DWTS 15 – The Great Quickstep Debate: Breaking Hold vs. Not Breaking Hold
In his Access Hollywood interview from after Monday night’s show, Mark explained his reasons for “breaking hold” in he in Bristol’s quickstep – and he also insinuated that a few other couples also broke hold in their quicksteps this week, yet didn’t get called out by the judges. So it got me thinking: did the judges, indeed, turn a blind eye to some couples’ rule-breaking, while calling out others?
First, a little bit of background as to why breaking hold in quickstep is such a big deal. Earlier this year, I went into detail about it in one of my “Ask Courtney” posts – the basic gist is that quickstep is the only ballroom dance on DWTS that is only danced in the International Standard style, in which you cannot break hold at all, and they’ve carried that rule over to DWTS. I personally think it’s kind of a dumb rule, considering that DWTS is not a real ballroom competition (and never will be), and considering that you can break hold in the waltz, foxtrot, Viennese waltz, and sometimes tango (the last one is whole different debate).
When we use the term “in hold”, it refers to the standard ballroom position: lady’s left arm bent at the elbow & rested upon the man’s right arm (also bent at the elbow) with her hand approximately on the man’s right bicep; man’s right hand on the lady’s left shoulder blade; lady’s right arm & man’s left arm outstretched & curved slightly with hands clasped. With the rule as it stands on DWTS, the couple can do a little bit of open work at the beginning of the routine, a little bit of open work at the end, and that’s it – for the bulk of the dance, they should be in hold. However, things can get a little bit…iffy, from time to time, and some of the pros have found creative ways to not stay in hold for the entire routine. Luckily for us, this week was an interesting smorgesbord of both legal & illegal quickstep tactics – so let’s take a look at some examples.
Example #1: The blatant, completely broken hold
I’ve got to side with the judges on this one – they completely broke hold TWICE after starting the dance in-hold, and only spent about 40 seconds of the dance in-hold…and 33 seconds out of it. Yes, I actually went to the trouble of counting 😯 I’m leaning towards Mark not really caring whether they got called out or not (I actually found his rant about it to Access Hollywood to be a bit more aloof than I’ve come to expect from Mark when he’s pissed), but for the sake of argument, let’s say Mark actually wanted to make this routine slightly more pleasing to the judges. A smarter move would have been to take a page out of Val’s book (see below) and just rearrange the order of the routine a bit – move the long line dancing section to the beginning of the routine, then get into hold, do the quickstep part, and end with the beer bottle bit. In that instance, Len might have just grumbled a bit about “too much messing about at the beginning”, but at least it would have been more of a wishy-washy matter of opinion on the dance, rather than an out-and-out infraction that may have potentially cost them points…and triggered Carrie Ann into hyperb*tch mode. Other examples: Shawn & Mark’s quickstep in season 8, Nicole & Derek’s quickstep in season 10
Example #2: The sneaky 1-hand hold
I kind of hate this category, in which the couples may break one part of their dance hold to do something like an underarm turn, but still keep one hand clasped to each other to give the impression that they haven’t broken hold. In real-life ballroom, this would be penalized in competition. However, since DWTS seems to only selectively follow real rules, this seems to be acceptable on the show (watch me say that this week, and then next week someone gets called out for doing it). I personally don’t see why it’s necessary, considering that quickstep is a a dance that was created to be danced entirely in dance hold, and underarm turns aren’t typical quickstep fare. Tell that to Louis & Sabrina, who had 2 instances like this in their quickstep. The first turn Sabrina did (:52 mark) was kind of cool, but I felt like the turn Louis did (at the 1:07 mark) just didn’t belong there choreographically, and actually detracted a bit from the dance for me. Had I been Len, I might have issued a little bit of a warning about it – “You’re toeing the line, missy!” – but I don’t know that I would have deducted any points for it, per se. Other examples: Helio & Julianne’s quickstep in season 5, Chelsea & Mark’s quickstep in season 12
Example #3: Stalling before getting into dance hold
This is a tactic I often see used by pros whose partners aren’t exactly adept at quickstep – they spend as much time as possible doing other, non-quicksteppy things at the beginning and end of the routine in order to minimize the amount of time they’re actually having to do quickstep. I think both Kym and Val utilized this strategy this week – but I noticed it moreso with Kelly & Val’s routine. They spent about the first 23 seconds of their quickstep doing some pretty, swirly stuff that really looked more like American smooth waltz figures to me – something I’m a little surprised that Len didn’t call them out for, since he’s notorious for griping about “too much messin’ about”, but given that their music felt wayyyy too flowy & pretty for a quickstep to me, I think it kind of fit, choreographically. It also pared down the amount of time Kelly was in dance hold, which was a good thing – she looked pretty shaky to me during the actual quickstep sequence. Going with this strategy is a bit of a “lesser of two evils” scenario: you run the risk of getting griped at by Len for choreographic choices, but you also lower your risk of your partner making a glaring mistake that the judges might actually deduct points for. Other examples: Pam & Damian’s quickstep in season 10, Hope & Maks’ quickstep in season 13
Example #4: Staying in hold the whole time (the way it’s supposed to be done)
I would say this category is the closest you can get to a “real life” quickstep on DWTS – the couple doesn’t do a whole lot of futzing around at the beginning, they get into hold, and they stay in hold the whole time, only breaking to a little bit of open work in the last few seconds. It’s the least risky in terms of upsetting the judges for more regulatory infractions -the couple is not wasting time “fussin’ about” and is not doing anything that might possibly be considered breaking hold; but it also leaves the couple the most vulnerable to making a mistake, as you’re doing proper quickstep for longer than those employing any of the tactics I mentioned above. If you go this route – you better be legitimately good at quickstep 😛 For that reason, I would say only those couples that are truly skilled tend to go this route – and I found Apolo & Karina’s quickstep to be the perfect example. No gimmicks, no stalling, no extraneous non-quickstep moves – just plain good quickstep. 🙂 Other examples: Laila & Maks’ 2nd quickstep in season 4, Jennifer & Derek’s quickstep in season 11
So knowing all of this – do I think Mark had a valid argument when he claimed other couples broke hold but didn’t get called out? Mehhh…not really. 😛 Were there some iffy things going on in some of the routines, that the judges probably should have at least touched upon in their critiques? Sure. But did anyone else blatantly break hold like Bristol & Mark did…multiple times? No way Jose. But what do you guys think? Should the rules of quickstep be set in stone…or should there be some room for interpretation?
I’m not sure . Shawn and Mark quickstep is probably my favorite ever, and Nicole and Derek were amazing as well. So in the end I don’t really mind. I’m waiting to see this week, Derek seems to be planing breaking some rules.
I don’t know what it is with the judges sometimes, sometimes they ignore stuff or complain about something and one dance later the same thong happens and they say nothing. When they have their favorites they seems to forget stuff (Gilles, Sabrina, William and etc).
I like it when the pros can take it like a man (or woman), break the rule, take the consequence of judges critique, knowing they did it to be more entertaining/memorable. Of course when it’s just done to prevent bad dancing from being noticeable…? I guess since there really isn’t time usually to teach really good dance technique to someone who isn’t a natural or has some experience, in the blitz to the finals, it is the job of the pro to make their celeb look good and not bad sooo…
Funny you point out how Louis twisted the rules to suit him as his blog this week made such a huge point of “rules are rules”, talking about how they’re only allowed 10 seconds at the beginning and at the end out of hold. Selective rule breaking? Little hypocrisy going on there?
I really really enjoyed Apolo and Karina’s quickstep, have watched it a few times this week.
I just hope that the whole “be creative” and “do things we haven’t seen before” BS is explained to the couples, and the judges understand it, as well. Len is too narrow minded and often judges by his style preference. The problem is he calls some people out for it and others skate by. He wanted more from Shawn and Derek. I thought the Jive was great, and like Bruno said, totally in sync. What “more” did he want? But, Emmitt’s ChaCha from week 1 looked like something he did back in Season 3; so where was the comment about wanting more from him? Instead, it was declared the best of the night!
I am really getting tired of complaining about a show that I once loved to pieces. TPTB really screwed up All Stars by having people who didn’t really dance well the first time around. “cough” BP This should only be about good dancers! If we have a repeat of Season 11, I think I might be done with this show – especially if Derek is gone.
I guess the reasoning for the quickstep rules on DWTS are to make it more challenging than other dances, but that doesn’t mean it makes sense! 🙂 Considering that most of the audience is not aware of ballroom rules and that the rest of the show is not “strictly ballroom,” I think they should throw the rule out.
Regarding Carrie Ann’s comment to Bristol about “slamming back,” I thought that was a little harsh and I CAN’T STAND it when stars are blamed for choreography decisions.
Of the quicksteps mentioned above, I enjoyed Apolo and Karina’s the most and I thought it showed the most variety. Louis and Sabrina’s was okay, and I wasn’t that crazy about the beginning. It almost seemed a bit gimicky to me, like Louis couldn’t think of a good way to begin the dance.
On a completely unrelated note, I think we need a “You mad, bro?” meme when Mark is asking Bristol if she is mad during the results show footage. She was so made, she couldn’t even be bothered to put in contacts for results night! 🙂
Thanks for the recap Courtney! Always interesting and well-thought-out.
Well, I guess if one of the main things about DWTS is to watch and evaluate how the celebrity is learning the dances, then there have to be some rules to evaluate them by. Logically. 😉 I do think, though, that if the judges are going to remark on something like the breaking of hold, then what they need to do is have a refresher or a quick explanation of the dance in question so that the viewers/voters can make a decision themselves whether it’s a big deal or not. Does that make sense?
I kinda agree with Mark in one sense since there is one other notable quickstep tht broke hold and is iconic (nicole and derek) BUT it was danced brilliantly. Bristol and Mark’s was a hot mess.
notable quickstep that came to my mind off the bat*
I normally don’t like for the celeb to be blamed for something during a dance either, but this season I think they should be, this is an all star season, Bristol has been thru this before, she knows the rules esp when back on her season they called her out for doing it on her tango. I think by now she should be comfortable enough to say to Mark I don’t think we should break the hold or something to that effect. Second time around she can make suggestions and not just do everything Mark says, esp when she knows it’s wrong
Courtney, I have to thank you for all the posts you do this style.
I still think the big problem is the rules are not clear on DwtS – because isn’t as ballroom championships or entirely new – and some of the pros just don’t give a importance to them. My opinion… =/
Thanks for this information, Courtney. It is so helpful for me, especially because I do not come from a dance background.
My favorite quickstep this week was Apolo and Karina’s, and I did notice and appreciate how they stayed in hold. However, I don’t necessarily have a problem with the other “mild” rule breakers you mentioned. But Bristol and Mark’s dance…I don’t know…I can’t imagine it really was a quickstep at all. I just didn’t see any elements that (to my untrained eye) are movements looked for in this dance. For Mark to complain that they were called out for breaking hold is silly to me, as I would think traditional ballroom judges would have had a lot more problems with that dance than just breaking hold. I think the judges were extraordinarily kind to them, even considering Carrie Ann’s comment, so to me his complaints just come across as childish.
The problem wasn’t so much that they broke hold, but that they broke hold for SO LONG. It was hardly a quickstep and I’m sure that’s obvious to Mark. The judges always go back and forth on calling out rules, so it’s not surprising at all.
Still, 6 is a pretty generous score for breaking the rules on top of lousy dancing.
This may not go here but really people it’s a dance show. At the end of the day they all go home like we do. If your taking it that seriously something is wrong. And in doing so will up Bristols vote count. If you like her or not, nobody deserves that over an entertainment show.
http://www.tmz.com/2012/10/04/cbs-suspicious-package-dancing-with-the-stars-bristol-palin/
Not saying anyone here is taking it to the extreme just wanted to FYI you all. Crazy nutjobs out there.
Yes Leigh, there’s no shortage of wackos in the world. For all we know since the threat was not directed at Bristol but at the show, this could be a crazed Bristol fan who decided this would be a great way to (a) freak out those nasty Hollywood people who are being so mean to Bristol and (b) generate sympathy for her from the public. What a nuisance for the celebs and pros, not to mention everyone else who works at CBS.
Great post! I love it when I get show news/opinion and I also learn about a dance step. Thanks!
What Jay said! I love this stuff – as far as I can tell, this is the kind of post you find nowhere else on internet websites that cover DWTS.
Assuming that the judges deducted something for breaking hold (as they did for Nicole/Derek and others), does that mean Bristol/Mark would otherwise have gotten 7s or even 8s? Hmm…
My problem with Bristol and Mark is not the dancing, really. There have been plenty of contestants I have loved that could not dance a lick (Ty Murray and Carson Kresley come immediately to mind 🙂 For me, Bristol is an average dancer with a lousy attitude, who could probably be a good dancer if she adjusted her ‘tude. And it seems her demeanor is rubbing off on Mark. It’s always so “in your face” with her, it seems to me. Maybe in private she’s not like that, hearing people on the show refer to her as sweet and funny and shy. But to me she comes off as being very confrontational, I guess is the best way to describe it …. “yea, we broke the rules, so what, I don’t care”. Breaking the rules on DWTS, in the grand scheme of things, is nothing, but – as a commenter above put it – at least own up to it, with grace and humor. Mark should have known better, but he seems to have bought into the “no matter what we do, they’re gonna hate us” schtick. I have a terrible feeling this season will be much like S11 where she dances much longer than anyone of us could believe ….. I’d be delighted to be wrong on that one 🙂
I think part of it is that Bristol continues to say that she doesn’t care what anyone thinks, it’s just a dancing show anyway. And she’s right, but deary, don’t be saying it out loud. People who love the show are not going to be impressed by your dismissal of it. I dunno… *throws up hands* … if she was my daughter, I’d tell her to at least PRETEND to be a little more invested.
Thank you everyone – glad you guys enjoyed the post 🙂 I think the thing that really cooked my goose was Mark trying to play it off like the other couples had done things just as bad as he & Bristol in their own quicksteps…and after going through each of the other routines with a fine-toothed comb, I could find NOTHING even remotely as blatant as the multiple, prolonged times they broke hold to do stuff that didn’t even remotely resemble quickstep. Just Mark trying to diffuse some of the scrutiny, I guess. But still, dude – own up to it. Bristol did not make you break hold, the song did not make you break hold, the one-armed man did not make you break hold – YOU, as the pro, made that decision, as you ultimately have the final say in the choreography. And if any of the above factors did influence you – then maybe it’s time to grow some cojones.
And I agree with Evaine – even if Bristol could give a rat’s ass about what America/the judges/the other couples/whoever think of her, she doesn’t need to broadcast it. The viewers tune in to be entertained, so to me, if one the celebs is basically saying “I don’t care enough to try and entertain you”, then I feel like saying “Then I don’t care enough to pick up a phone for your ungrateful ass.” If you don’t give a sh*t about the show, then maybe you shouldn’t be on it. Just sayin’…
I think what Mark did was try make the routine less boring, he knew that Bristol could not do any cool fancy footwork, so he tried something different.
I kind fell bad for Mark (and Tristan, Maks). Being a all star season, every pro should have a good partner, for Mark is even harder having two of his best partners in the show dancing with other people, to see Shawn and Sabrina in the top , both giving everything, pushing themselves, while he is stuck with Bristol and her horrible attitude can’t be easy. Every time that Shawn or Sabrina finish their dance, Mark has the same serious face like he is not enjoying at all.
Last time I saw him with actual smile on his face was when Brooke was interviewing Shawn and he was close to her making some joke, and she look at him and they both started laughing.
I don’t mind the dances having certain rules. It may not be a real ballroom competition, but it still is a competition. That being said, it does annoy me when the judges are inconsistent with calling out people for breaking the rules. However, I can’t really recall a couple who blatantly broke hold in there quickstep and didn’t get called out for it.
I think that since this is not REAL competitions, if they break hold for a long period or it ruins the flow or looks nothing like a QS(mark+Bristol) they should deduct depending on how bad it is. But if it doesn’t really disrupt the dance and is done once or twice, smoothly, they might no give it a 10 but shouldn’t deduct more if thedance is perfect otherwise. But the judges should also be CLEAR + CONSISTANT which they aren’t. The pros used to be so profesional about handling these things(and other things!!) correctly and now it’s a free-for-all. Only 2 or 3 of them act like team players and true professionals anymore…I’m with Linz..almost had enuf.
I think Mark was just being diffusive, although he isn’t 100% wrong about rule breaking, technically. Even if he is, he’s not wrong that judges are not consistent at all, which has to be frustrating for the pros. However, I do think their dance should have scored 5’s at best because of the blatant rule breaking and horrible execution.
And I just wanted to echo the love for Apolo and Karina’s dance. It instantly became one of my all-time favorites for its difficulty and excellent execution.
We are arguing over whether the judges should be consistent in calling out contestants on holds in Quickstep? The same judges that are so back A$$ward in every other judging sense? The same judges that praised Bristol for the monkey suit dance and wanted more time in the suit, but criticized Derek and Jennifer for too much ‘fluffing about’ with the feather duster (Len, I’m talking to you…).
There is NOTHING consistent in their judging. At all. that’s the frustrating part for fans and dancers alike
Oh, and I forgot to say… GREAT post! Loved it.
It is a fact that the voting on DWTS has been hijacked by Vote for the Worst techno geeks. Here is how they describe their VFTW mission:
“Votefortheworst.com was started in 2004 to support voting for the entertaining contestants who the producers would hate to see win on American Idol. We vote en masse for the contestant that we feel provides the most entertaining performances that go against what the producers want in a winner and that annoy the viewing public…”
They are proudly touting their votes for Brisdull (or The Chin, as she is known in Alaska). In fact, you can find a whole section on how they skewed the vote for Chin when she was on DWTS previously.
It really makes me sad for all the other dancers and pros who are working so hard to do their best. Not to mention the disappointment for the fans that the voting is rigged by VFTW. Of course, Chin loves it cuz $he knows $he can do terribly and still win — as a Paylin, $he is so delusional Brisdull thinks the votes are from her ‘fan base.” HA!
Yeah that vote for the worst site makes me sick, because of them they got Taylor Hicks the win on idol year back.
I am not really a Bristol fan either, her attitude stinks. Hopefully she is gone next week but I still think she will possibly make Final 7 at least
Ashley, DITTO! I don’t like that “Vote for the worst” site either. This is just all the more reason we all need to vote our tails off in the coming weeks if we don’t want to see your favorite dancers leave too early. I just hate the thought of Bristol knocking out the better dancers like she did the last time. 🙁
And Court, good job. I LOVED reading this post!!
One thing that bugs me about Mark, is his whole attitude about the show is very dependent on WHO he is dancing with, and (IMO) whether they have a shot at the trophy at the end. I LOVED Katherine last season, and I loved the Mark that we saw with her, but I couldn’t get past “The Mark of Seasons Past” that completely peeved me off week after week. And yes, his attitude with Bristol in their prior season STUNK! and unfortunately, we “get” that Mark back.
So, I am not surprised at his attitude about being called out about breaking hold in their quickstep, it seems to continue B and M’s feelings… No, I don’t know this for sure, but just what it feels like to me, my own opinion… That they’re not getting what they feel their entitled to.
Mark is an amazing choreographer, and he KNOWS that he could easily have come up with choreography that went well with the song, and fit Bristol, AND stayed within the rules, but no. The whole of it should land on HIS shoulders, and he should grow up and accept the responsibility for doing his partner wrong about breaking hold.
I seem to remember an issue about the quickstep in their season, and them breaking hold, and there was controversy then, too. And, if I am remembering correctly, they re-did their quickstep in the finale, and Mark gave Bristol a choice, leave the break in or take it out, and she said something like, “I don’t care what the judges say,” and danced it the way they originally danced.
I think we are in for a long season with Bristol…. Mark definitely knows how to generate buzz, and let’s face it….. He did get buzz for them!
What I’m worried about is that we’re going to get season 12 Mark again next season. You know, the big a$$ he turned into after her partnered Brisotl the last time.
I hope not. Most of the time I like Mark pretty okay, but that season I could not stand him.
My best remembered quickstep is Mya and Dmitry’s. The best, to me, Monday night was between Louis and Sabrina and Karina and Apollo. Quicksteps have never been one of my favorites but I can appreciate one that is well done.
Ok, I think everyone may be giving “Vote for the Worst” a little too much credit – it’s just a website, not a form of Jedi mind control that forces people to vote for crappy contestants. You have to keep in mind that the mainstream viewers (and voters) for shows like DWTS & Idol are not the type that are going to heed what VFW says – hell, I don’t even think they’d waste time even going to that site. The type of people going to VFW are the fringe – a smaller portion of viewers, or even non-viewers just looking to troll. The vote of the average viewer is always going to outnumber to vote of a small group of renegades – no matter how much the renegades claim they’re voting. And I don’t even think VFW even jumped on the Bristol bandwagon until midway through season 11, when it became clear she had staying power – and then they tried to take credit for her getting as far as she did. So Cod, if they’re talking about how they “skewed the votes” the last time, they’re bullshitting – I’d say it was likely a small but devoted legion of Tea Partiers (paired with the idiotic judges and their wussed-out scores) that deserve the credit for Bristol staying around the last time. Seriously, pay no mind to VFW – they like to think they’re a lot more powerful than they really are.
And as for Taylor Hicks – as I recall, he was actually pretty mainstream popular on his season…he may not have been the best singer on his season, but I do remember him having a lot of likeability with the average viewer. So for VFW to try and claim they helped him win? That’s about like Al Gore claiming he invented the internet. 😛 Besides, I don’t think I even remember any of the other contestants from his season…I can’t even remember who the runner up was.
I think breaking the hole can increase the creativity and
malleability of entertaining factors of thewhole dance, although judge may reduce the point. Shawn and Mark’s Aladdin quickstep is one of my all-time favourites.
Yeah I don’t think VFTW can hold a candle to regular voters. I don’t think that many people are interested in “taking down” DWTS or Idol. And Taylor was popular. My opinion of his popularity is probably a bit skewed, I admit, because I live in Alabama where Soul Patrol Mania was everywhere. Taylor even went to school in the town I live in and played the bar circuit around here for a while. Before his idol run, of course.
But, c’mon, Courtney, Taylor’s season was DAUGHTREY’s season 🙂 And Kellie Pickler and Katherine McPhee, who was the runner up.
I know way too much about past Idol seasons, LOL.
Lori, you’re thinking of their tango, not quickstep.
I think the key reason that Bristol stays around is that there even if her fanbase is relatively small, they are devoted to her and don’t split their votes with other contestants.
What Fig said plus the VFTW site is going to keep her around long enuf to lose some good couples…If the judges weren’t so scared of her mom sitting in the audience and all of Mark’s “connections” with this show and scored her dancing for what it is….horrible, especially in this crowd, there might be a chance of not losing alot of the really entertaining couples. so early. It’s maddening.
And the reason Mark is doing the QS that way is because it is possible the hardest dance to do, because of staying in hold, and Bristol is incapable of doing it well. He’s bloviating to distract attention and delusional. He goes between acting like they should be in the top 3 to acting like he’d rather have been gone yesterday. Anyway, thought he was “sick of being that dancer guy” and was really more into being a singing “star”. Again this is all the producers faults….should have never asked her back BUT it’s all about ratings.
Guys, once again, IT’S NOT VFW THAT’S KEEPING HER AROUND – let’s get that talking point off of the table and just not even factor them into the equation. They’re just a website, they just put the suggestion out there – it’s the nutjobs actually doing the voting that are keeping Bristol in, as well as the judges and their cop-out scoring. And I daresay the bulk of the nutjobs doing the voting aren’t even coming from VFW – they’re just the delusional Bristol fans that worship the ground the Palins walk on. Lord knows enough of them have descended upon Pure to spout their deranged gospel and curse the rest of us for “ganging up on such an accomplished young lady”. Goddamn, I can’t even say it with a straight face 😛 And Mimi, I don’t know why you’d think the judges would be scared of Sarah – the woman has very little clout left outside of the Tea Party movement, and it would be a huge waste of her resources to try and orchestrate some sort of retaliation against the judges of a reality tv dance show. It’s not like she’s going to put a hit out on Len for giving Bristol a 6. Let’s blame the real culprit here: the judges, for just being idiots with their scoring.
In the end, yes, we’re going to lose some good couples while Bristol sticks around. But we can’t stop the nutjobs from voting for her, and we can’t really do anything about the judges’ scoring her too sympathetically. All you can do is keep voting hard for the couples that deserve to be there, and avoid splitting your votes. Eventually, the judges will wise up – all we can hope for is that they do it sooner than they did in season 11.
Yeah, I doubt VFW is anything more than a minuscule factor. Bristol should have had a 15 for that dance, at best. At least she isn’t getting 7’s and such, but still is being overscored. If she wonders again why she isn’t getting 9’s and 10’s I may projectile vomit.
Judges overscoring & a small group of rabid, overzealous fans – whether they be tea-party or shippers (oh god, the Bristol and Mark shippers are the worst) are enough to keep her around when someone like Joey has a bad week and people switch their votes to Drew to keep him around. I wonder what the Helio effect might be after last week.
Courtney thank you so much for all your great articles. I am among the people who get so discouraged to see Bristol stay while other much better dancers go. I never heard of VFW until last year and was part of a site that covered AI. Guess I have been hiding under a rock. lol I also said in another post how much I enjoyed Helio’s Quick Step from his season. It was just fun to watch for me. I don’t know what all the technical terms are for the dances, but one thng I noticed in Bristol and Mark’s Quick Step was when they were in hold I did not see her doing any of those steps where they kick their feet up and to the side as the couple are standing in place. I wish I knew what they were called and my description is not the best, but hope you know what I am trying to describe. I see all the other dancers doing it, but did not see Bristol do that at all. So putting the hold arguement aside I just thought their dance was not even a Quick Step. It reminde me more of a Two Step and Line Dance Routine and even that is stretching it a lot. I loved Apollo and Karina’s Quick Step. Probably one of the best I have seen and obviously the best technically as you have demonstrated to us with your writeup. I thought he was short changed by the judges as I liked it more than Sabrina and Louie’s. I hated the season Bristol was first on and to see more talented dancers leave and her stay frustrated me to no end. I am so afraid as already demonstrated that it will happen again and this season of all seasons is just so wrong. I wish they never brought her back. It will make a joke out of the first All Star season which for me should be more about dancing and less of a popularity contest than any season. I have already taken your advice and did not split my votes. I have heard people that felt bad for Bristol toss a few votes her way just because they felt bad for her. All I could do was shake my head in disbelief. Again, thank you for all your great articles and teaching me a thing or two about ballroom dancing. If you can figure out what steps in the Quick Step I am trying to explain I would love to know what they are called. Also, are they required? I would think so since all the other dancers worked them in.
I just wanted to add that the steps I am talking about take place staring around the 56 second mark of Apollo and Karina’s dance. Watching yet again I see they did a lot of extra steps not done by the other couples and especially Bristol. Also, sorry for the typo in my comment that should have said reminds and not reminde. Thanks again.
@Gail – I think you’re referring to Charleston steps, and Bristol & Mark did actually have a very brief section of them towards the end of their routine – but Bristol messed up and so it didn’t really look anything like a Charleston step. 😛
Thanks so much Courtney. I will have to recheck the video for Bristol, but if she messed up I guess I won’t be seeing that much. I do appreciate you gettig back to me.
Ok, Cod Piece, you’ve worn out your welcome – so far I’ve let you get up on your soapbox, use annoying nicknames, and generally just spout propaganda and state your own opinion as fact. Now I’m wondering if you yourself work for VFTW, because the way you’re touting them as this well-oiled vote manipulation machine, it’s almost as though you’re trying to promote them. The reality is that they are no better than the average voter at drumming up votes for any contestant – and as I’ve already stated, whatever they do really doesn’t have much of an impact on anything, considering that the average viewer voting a handful of times will always outnumber a voting minority voting hundreds of times. And spare me your own assertions (and paranoid ramblings) about the effect VFTW has on DWTS…or how many Tea Partiers there are. No more conspiracy theories, extraneous $ signs, or tabloid sensationalizing. Move on.
No, Vin – Mark was talking about quicksteps that broke the rules and didn’t get called out. Nicole and Derek most certainly got called out on it – and worse than Bristol and Mark did.
Anyway, I was under the impression that he was talking about Monday night, not the whole run of the series.
I agree Derek and Nicole were called out too but not as bad as Mark and Bristol and hey got complimented becuase I think two of judges (or was it just carrie ann? I think Bruno enjoyed it a lot too) said they would pay to see it on the road. Carrie Ann was jsut plain mean to Bristol and Mark but to tell you the truth I literally fell off my chair I was laughing so hard when Carrie Ann was like “snap back at ya”.
Courtney: I”ve learned so much about ballroom dancing from your posts’ that I sometimes actually know what the dancers are supposed to be doing! I loved Jennifer and Derek’s Quickstep,and I thought Karina and Apollo’s was great. I think when it is done right it is a fun dance.Bristol obviously has a chip on her shoulder and there is no way she could think she is anywhwere near as good as the other couples. I do have to say that she looks great though!
On a side note, out of all the quicksteps that night, Apollo and Karina wer in hold 100%. Is breaking hold a huge point deduction at competitions other than dancing with the stars as well? I was jsut curious
What I think the pros have to do is: 1) TELL their partner when they are doing something against the rules and warn them that they judges might get pissed. Put the decision on them. Bristol is a whiny bitch who won’t take responsibility, then take the rule breaking part OUT of the dance. If it sucks as a result, it’s on her. 2) If they decide to take their chances with the rule breaking, SUCK IT UP AND TAKE IT LIKE A MAN. Look at your brother, Markie. He knowingly breaks the rules, he takes responsibility for the scores they get, no matter how painful. If Bristol whines about THAT – give it right back to her. She can’t have it both ways.
I get the impression that Mark is not being honest with Bristol, or is not correcting her when she gets a wrong idea in her head. She feels entitled to better scores or feels they want to get rid of her for a REASON. Don’t be “boo hoo we deserved a better score” when you know full well that with that little amount of quickstep you were going to get docked, big time. Mark’s comments to the media and sour face on camera is feeding Bristol’s delusions. Maybe she would have those delusions anyway, who knows – but what he does is not helping. Not to excuse Bristol at all – she’s horrendous.
I don’t mind the rule breaking, as I’ve said a hundred times. Sometimes, it’s more important to make an impression so the audience doesn’t forget you. What always gets me every time is when the pros do some thing that they know the judges will hate (rule breaking, messin’ about, etc), they get marked down by the judges, then they complain about it to everyone who will listen afterward. Hello, most everyone who is a big fan of the show KNOWS you’re going to get yelled at, you’ve been on the show for years, WHY are you acting like that? It’s stupid.
Well, Vin, Didn’t Len give Nicole like a 7 or something, and Bristol got a 6?? Nicole is a thousand times the dancer that Bristol is, so I consider that calling our far, FAR worse than what Bristol got.
I will get off the VFTW ‘soapbox’ — and can assure you that I do not have any affiliation with them. The only reason I am so adamant is because it breaks my heart that anyone would try and mess up legit voting that works against the other dancers – no matter where it’s coming from. And VFTW does have the capability to generate thousands of bogus votes.
Wow, I was happy to find a DWTS site that is so knowledgable and interesting – but I guess unless visitors keep within certain boundaries they are not welcome. My comments are certainly not as profane or insulting as several others. It’s tough not to Palin bash when one is from Alaska and knows them so well. But I’ll move on.
Princess Heidi! Here I am, sipping a beer, munching some chips, scrolling down the comments and, thump-thump-thump! Bristol gets it right between the eyes! As she should, as should Mark. The problem for us, unfortunately, is that she’s of a piece with her mom – nothing is ever their fault. They are professional victims. Relentless, too. I dare say, if she were homely or more overweight than last time, and minus the facial work, we’d never be seeing her now.
@ACP, your last post did sound like it was promoting that other website, and I do agree with it being pulled. I have seen some of your other posts, and that one seemed to go much further than those…. This is a great site, And, it’s quite a bit of work to keep it from becoming similar to other sites, where the main purpose of most people is to trash and bash…..
I like that people can express their opinion on all of the dancers, and the celebrities and judges, and still manage to show some respect to those we don’t like, even if it’s not using spellings and symbols similar to what you posted…
Yes,there are boundaries, it’s never been hidden… Trash and bash too much, and it will get pulled, even if you say something that C and PH agree with completely. Opinions are opinions, not facts…. Be prepared to prove what you say, if asked….
There are many wonderful people who read and post on here, and all of us have differing opinions… I love seeing respect with differing thoughts.
Actually, I think that Len may have given Nicole and Derek a 6 – same as Bristol and Mark.
Cod Piece, if you are glad to have found us, why not post in the other topics about the other dancers and such too? You haven’t been banned yet. I think you can understand that you were carrying your hatred for Bristol a little too far. I’m not fond of her, her dancing, or her or her families politics, but, I’m not going on about it post after post.
Court, I always love your Ask Courtney post. I never learn dancing but I have always love it! And when you mention Jedi mind control I can’t help but think of Cole & Chehon. haha. I miss that ninja!
And ahh.. I hate to say this, but I feel this post really make people talk more about Bristol. Shouldn’t we focus more about the contestant we want to stay, like Apolo and Shawn? Can we have posts about them too? It’s like Bush re-election, people talk more about him, that why he stayed. haha.
Bristol seemed well aware that they were outside of bounds with their dance. That’s the important thing imo. I didn’t think the dance was any worse than Kirstie’s, except Kirstie is better at strutting and role playing.
Vogue … Your point is well taken and I appreciate it. Thanks for letting me continue to participate – I will curb my Bristol outrage as I recognize it is misplaced on Pure.
Well, it’s not all “misplaced”. I mean…many of us aren’t wild about her either and it’s hard holding back about it sometimes (myself included). I think you know what Court’s getting at and why she had enough. Just cool it some and don’t talk about that site anymore or you’ll have to move on.
[…] I fully acknowledge that Bristol & Mark broke hold in their dance (if you haven’t yet, see my post about it) and I agree that the judges were right in pointing it out. HOWEVER – I don’t endorse […]
[…] I fully acknowledge that Bristol & Mark broke hold in their dance (if you haven’t yet, see my post about it) and I agree that the judges were right in pointing it out. HOWEVER – I don’t endorse […]