PureDWTS Season 24: Why Normani Didn’t Win
So, to say that the four days following the announcement of the winner of season 24 of DWTS have been “interesting”, would be an understatement 😛 I’ve seen mainly rejoicing, but also some general rage from the Harmonizers, who simply can’t fathom how Normani came in 3rd place and insist that the show must be rigged/racist/sexist/capitalist/whatever-ist because she didn’t win. While this is unfortunately the type of behavior many of us have come to expect from that particular group of fans, there have been a few fans that have sincerely expressed a desire to know why I think Normani didn’t win. So here is my sincere response – if you are genuinely puzzled as to how it happened, this is my personal opinion, backed up with some numbers and some general observations about voting behavior. Very little of this actually has anything to do with Normani herself – most of these are factors that were out of her control, out of her fans’ control, and weren’t really things that anyone (other than maybe the executive producers) could have done anything to fix. I think Normani herself was just kind of a victim of circumstance this season – just not destined to win, for whatever reason. So the cries of “You’re just being mean to Normani!!!”? Keep ’em to yourself or GTFO.
So if you are genuinely interested, read on – and if you can remain civil and level-headed, feel free to comment or ask questions. But if you’re just here to complain about us or just generally be obnoxious, I will delete comments and permanently blacklist posters without a second thought – I’ve never witnessed the same level of vitriol from some fanbases as I saw this season. I have no time for it.
1.) Normani simply didn’t appeal to the main viewing demo to the same degree that David & Rashad did.
I thought I covered this pretty well early on in the season in this post, but apparently it bears repeating (and probably some more explanation) before I think it will start to settle in. Repeat after me: if the average viewer is not voting for you, you will not win DWTS. You HAVE to get the average, middle-aged, conservative-leaning, female viewer on your side and motivated to vote for you if you have a hope and a prayer of winning this show. And celebrities of certain profiles are more apt to motivate that demographic – football players, Olympians, country boys, military servicemen, etc…feel free to read into more detail at the link, I’m not going to repeat the same things over and over. But I would like to point out that singers/tv stars/etc. that typically appeal to the younger generation (like the members of Fifth Harmony, or Disney kids like Chelsea Kane & Roshon Fegan, or online stars like Hayes Grier) tend to REALLY struggle on this show, as a matter of principle – they either get ousted much earlier than expected, or need significant assistance from the judges/producers to stay afloat. It may just be that Normani just wasn’t grabbing as many of the main demographic votes as David (the show’s very first MLB player, a family man fresh off a world series win) and Rashad (an NFL player with an inspiring backstory).
2.) The Harmonizers are not as numerous as they might think, compared to the general viewing audience.
I saw a tweet circulating on Tuesday which included a tally of how some of the Harmonizers had amassed something to the tune of 600,000 votes for Normani over weeks 9 & 10. If it is true, it is impressive, and I applaud them – but unfortunately, if you do a little math, 600K ends up being not a whole lot in the grand scheme of things. Observe:
The total number of viewers in week 9 was 10.7 million; the total number of viewers for night 1 of the finale was 10.54 million. So let’s assume that’s 21.24 million potential voters determining the winner of season 24.
For the sake of being conservative, let’s say that only half the viewers actually vote – so 10.62 million. Of those voters, the bulk are exclusively phone voters (see previous post about voting behavior), and might only log 5 votes by mobile & landline each, for a total of 10 votes; a small fraction is power voters with multiple online accounts to vote with, in addition to a phone line or two; averaging that all together, let’s say each voter contributes 15 votes – which means the total number of votes could very well be something to the tune of 159 MILLION VOTES. When you divide 600K by 159,000,000, you get…roughly .38%. Not 38% – POINT THREE-EIGHT PERCENT. A fraction of a percentage point. Those 600K votes that particular group of Harmonizers worked so hard to get in only counted for a tiny fraction of the total number of votes.
Now, granted, I absolutely acknowledge that there were more folks voting for Normani that just weren’t part of the tally, and she likely was getting some of the general viewing audience to vote for her – but I think the 600K example just illustrates that, while that may seem like a HUGE number of votes in a vacuum, when you look at the grand scheme of things, it may not actually be all that much. Certainly no match for just the general viewing audience’s votes.
3.) Normani never landed in true jeopardy.
For the sake of clarification, by this I mean “was never one of the last two standing during an elim” – not Tom just saying “you’re in jeopardy” and then later telling the couple they were safe before singling out the final two. This may seem somewhat counter-intuitive, but hear me out: jeopardy can be a great way to stimulate votes for a couple that may not be getting them. Even if a couple isn’t actually in any danger of getting sent home anytime soon, it can be a good tool to use to nudge fans of that couple to vote a bit harder, with the effect being that the added boost might help them edge out another couple that TPTB don’t want to stick around as long, for whatever reason. To put it in more perspective, both Rashad and David ended up in true jeopardy in the three weeks leading up to the finale – the latter even ended up there twice. Normani never ended up in true jeopardy the entire season.
4.) The narrative seemed to indicate that Normani was going to win.
The “Normani is the best dancer and deserves to win” narrative by the judges had been going on for the better part of the season – near-perfect scores, gushing critiques, extra screen time with Erin, mic time for Normani’s grandma, good running order positions, the aforementioned lack of jeopardy appearances, etc. These all seemed to read to me as “Normani has this in the bag.” And what happens when a fanbase assumes they have something “in the bag”? They get tend to get a bit complacent – they maybe head to bed a bit earlier instead of staying up to vote more, they might stop making new accounts to vote with, they maybe forget to tweet out reminders to their followers to vote for Normani – or, in the case of the more casual fan, they may just decide they don’t need to vote, period. I myself even admit that, judging from the way things were being set up and what the judges were saying on finale night, that Normani was going to win – I think even texted Heidi and ask “Are you getting the same vibe I am? That Normani’s going to win this whole thing?” and she was getting the same impression. So you can imagine our pleasant shock when Rashad (who we had been rooting for all season, and who hadn’t gotten such preferential treatment) pulled out the win. So why did TPTB opt to give us the impression that Normani was going to win, if she was only going to end up in 3rd place? I have two theories: one, they really wanted to amplify the shock of her being in 3rd place – that’s the kind of drama that keeps people talking about the show long after it’s over; two, I almost feel like they wanted to spank America for not voting how they thought we should have – really rub in the “Normani should have won” narrative, and letting the shocked reactions from the judges/hosts/audience when she got third serve to imply to Rashad & David voters “You guys voted wrong!” Bear in mind that two completely new executive producers were at the helm this season, and they didn’t really follow the pattern of their two predecessors – so it’s impossible to know for sure what exactly they were trying to accomplish (and hell, they might have been just making stuff up as they went along), but those are the only two conclusions I came up with.
5.) Her high scores kept her relatively shielded for most of the season.
Seems like a lot of Harmonizers like to correlate Normani sticking around as long as she did to her getting “a ton of votes” every week. But really, we never really had any way of knowing whether that was true or not, because Normani was almost never in a position where she had to overcome a huge point deficit in order to stick around. More often than not, she had a nice cushion of at least 2-3 points that kept her far enough out of reach that at least 1-2 individuals further down on the score chart from her had no hope of closing the vote gap and staying in the game.
To illustrate, I went back through all of Heidi’s “Dancing By the Numbers” posts from this season, and looked at the number of votes the person that ended up getting eliminated that week would have needed to get past Normani – the reasoning behind this being that Normani only had best one person in combined total each week in order to stick around, and it’s entirely possible that she may not have been getting a “ton” of votes each week – she could actually been one of the lowest vote-getters, and had been getting just enough that at least one person each week couldn’t get past her. This becomes a bit easier to see when you look at some of the margins some of the other contestants had to get past her – more often than not, the person eliminated had margins of 20 to 30K votes (per million votes cast) to make up if they wanted to get past Normani (and for some of them, it was easy to see that this would have been an impossible feat, given their own fanbase or lack thereof). Interestingly, during the two weeks that the margin between Normani & the eliminated celebrity dropped under 10K, out-of-the-ordinary things were happening – for the week 4 totals, Erika only needed to get a little over 6K more votes per million votes cast than Normani to stick around, but that was the one week where Normani was initially told she was “in jeopardy” but was spared before the final two were called out. Think maybe they realized they had cut things a bit too close the previous week? Week 4 was the week of the tepid rumba that the judges only gave a 32 – and then boom, the next week (Disney Week), she suddenly shot up to a near-perfect score of 39…and didn’t stray more than a point or two from a perfect score the rest of the season. The other bit of funny business was the week of the double elim – when Normani was given immunity and we lost Nick and Nancy. I don’t know that Nick could have gotten past the ~20K margin he would have needed to stay over Normani, but I absolutely believe Nancy could have gotten past Normani with the ~9K margin between them, given the demographics of the show – so I would almost stake my life on it that Normani would have gone home that week, if not for the immunity she was given. As for the rest of the weeks – the ridiculous margin Bonner would have had to beat to stick around and boot Normani out after week 7 is almost humorous to me, and while I think Simone normally could have easily closed the gap between she & Normani in week 8, that was also the week where she got an unflattering edit, ridiculously critical comments from the judges, and was the week of “Smiling doesn’t win you gold medals!”-gate…so it was behavioral manipulation that likely did her in. Funny thing is, Normani had a tiny vote margin to overcome in the finale to beat Rashad – and she just couldn’t do it. Additionally, David had a fairly substantial margin to cover to beat Normani for 2nd place – and he still managed to cover it. It tends to make me believe that Heidi & I were on-target with our belief that David & Rashad were probably getting the lions share of the votes, and that Normani may not have actually been raking in the votes all season – she just had enough points and was getting just enough votes to stay afloat.
Week 1: Chris K. would have needed 33,113 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 2: Charo would have needed 21,277 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 3: Mr. T would have needed 31,476 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 4: Erika would have needed 6,135 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani. (NOTE: The only time Normani was called “in jeopardy”, but was not one of the last two standing.)
Week 5: Heather would have needed 16,500 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 6: Normani was granted immunity in the week 7 immunity challenge, but without it, Nick would have needed 20,446 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani; Nancy would have needed 9,294 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 7: Bonner would have needed 47,244 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 8: Simone would have needed 20,057 votes per million votes cast to get past Normani.
Week 9/10: David needed 23,100 votes per million votes cast to beat Normani (and he did); Normani needed 3,100 votes per million votes cast to beat Rashad (she didn’t).
6.) It’s not all about who the best dancer is.
It’s awfully easy for someone to say “the best dancer should win!” when their favorite is the best dancer – but if you’ve been watching this show for awhile, you know that couldn’t be further from the truth. True, the winner is usually at the very least a good dancer, but I would argue that the best dancer is not always the one that ends up on top. Example? I maintain that Paige was technically the best dancer of season 22, but was edged out for the win by Nyle, whose dancing was actually pretty inconsistent throughout the season. I would even go so far as to argue that fourth-place finisher Wanya was technically better than 3rd placer Ginger and eventual winner Nyle. So what, you might wonder, would possess people to vote for someone that wasn’t the best dancer? The answer is this: likeability. You gotta be a good dancer, but people also have to like you – so it helps if you’re nice, funny, memorable, relatable, or have an inspiring backstory. Paige may have been a fantastic dancer, but Nyle was completely deaf and had an amazing attitude about it – and that ultimately endeared him to the audience more. Another example: Donald Driver. Definitely not technically as good as Katherine Jenkins, and about on-par with William Levy, but he was far more personable and enthusiastic than either of the other two finalists. Applying that logic to this season, I would say that we just didn’t get to know Normani as well as we did David & Rashad – both men bared their souls fairly early on in the competition, with David showing us how important family was to him week after week, and Rashad sharing his struggles with his weight, a learning disability, his father’s alcoholism, and securing a place in the NFL. With Normani, I don’t feel like we really started to learn anything about her personally until much later on – after she & Val were done traveling. And even then, I felt like whenever she spoke, it was a bit measured and rehearsed, a la Corbin Bleu, and that’s when she wasn’t getting drowned out by Val talking over her. We just were not given as much of an opportunity to get to know Normani as we did David & Rashad.
7.) There seemed to be a few different kinds of voter fatigue happening.
This is a bit less concrete and more vague, but I did observe a few patterns of complaints from viewers that seemed to keep cropping up this season. One type of complaint I saw quite a bit had to do with the unusually high number o f female ringers this season – seemed like some viewers noticed (like we did!) how the male celebs were at a significant disadvantage this season, since none of them came in with any dance experience. I would venture a guess that some of them opted to vote against the preponderance of female ringers, which could also explain how three of the ringeriest female celebs this season got sent home far earlier than most expected, and how two men with no dance experience coming into the show managed to best a good dancer with a ton of experience in the finals. So that was “female ringer fatigue” – the other type of voter fatigue that I’ve seen a bit more of in recent years is “repeat pro winner” fatigue, where a larger chunk of the viewing audience has adopted a “I want to see a pro who hasn’t won before win!” attitude. This didn’t seem to be as big a deal in previous seasons, but given the recent repeat wins of Derek, Peta, & Val, I’m seeing a larger chunk of the fans saying “Let someone else win!” And that could also tie into what I like to call “manipulation-fatigue”, where fans tire of being spoon-fed propaganda on who to vote for – and given that the narrative this season seemed to favor Normani, I can see how some might chose to vote for anyone except her. So right there, Normani checks off three different boxes when it comes to voter fatigue: she was a ringer, her pro had just won for the second time, and the narrative generally jammed her down viewers throats this season.
So I guess to wrap it up – I think the main reason Normani didn’t win had to do with demographics: the main demo just wasn’t voting for her as much as they were the other two finalists, and I don’t think it’s something that just developed in the final week of the competition…I tend to think she probably wasn’t getting a ton of votes from the main demo all season long, and she just happened to be sufficiently shielded from elimination for the bulk of the season by her scores. On top of that, there were some minor issues that may have contributed to her voters possibly getting complacent, or just resulted in her not being able to pick up a ton of voters as the season wore on. I don’t think it had anything to do with race (last I checked, a POC won this season), I don’t think it had anything to do with sexism (if you really want to talk sexism, the female pros are probably the most marginalized group on the show – and Emma has probably gotten treated worse than any other female pro; and yet, she won this season), I think the odds were just stacked against Normani demographically – and while TPTB tried to give her a boost, it just was too much to overcome. I’ve seen the phrase “Normani got Zendaya’d” thrown around a lot – and really, I don’t think they were in the same boat; Zendaya likely got screwed by the online voting crashing the night of the finale voting – Normani doesn’t have that excuse. If anything, I’d say Normani got Chelsea Kane’d – someone that was a good dancer and that TPTB did everything they could to help, but in the end, it just wasn’t enough to overcome demographics.
I think this season’s final 2 solidified exactly what you said about who was voting this season. The general audience sent 2 fan favorite all around great guys to the final 2. They played right into the general demo that watches the show.
Now the big question is: Will TPTB start to treat Emma differently? She has proven that she is a top notch choreographer and a definite asset to the female pro lineup. She killed it!
Agreed 1000% Courtney! Well said!
Normani is a good dancer but I feel we didn’t get to “know” her as we did Rashad & David. I also think we didn’t really see an improvement arc as we did with Rashad. Normani’s already a pretty well-trained dancer. Rashad came in with zero dance experience.
But NEVER have I seen a more rabid & RUDE fan base as the Harmonizers! Even 5 days later, they’re still angry & attacking others on Twitter/Insta/FB
Thank you for taking the time to write this! I wholeheartedly agree with you. I know I am in the general demo of the show, although no longer a regular viewer. Once I knew about all the female ringers AND the fact that they were paired with the C bros., I automatically voted against them! Rashad and David and Nancy endeared themselves to me and I have enjoyed watching their pro partners for several seasons. It was easy to vote for them.
The N and V fans should just drop it already.
Thanks for doing this post Courtney! I agree 100% with what you said.
I kept seeing “Normani had the biggest fan base, so she should have won”. I responded she may have had the biggest celebrity fan base, but the biggest voting fan base are we viewers who have watched for seasons and vote regularly. There is a BIG difference between those two groups!
Also, as two side notes, I have to laugh at the people who say they aren’t going to watch because the “best” dancer didn’t win; are we EVER told to vote for the best? No, we’re told to vote for our favorite! What show have you been watching because I can list quite a few seasons where the “best” didn’t win! Second the rude, crude and lewd harmonizers really are funny when they say they won’t watch ever again; um, you only tuned in this season because Normani was on, you weren’t going to tune in next season anyway!
And Val gifted Normani with a crappy freestyle. That didn’t help matters either.
Could not agree more with every single reason listed-for me, particularly #7 where you talk about voter fatigue happening. I, personally, think a lot of people didn’t want to see Val win another mirrorball trophy, especially with partnered with who can now be considered as one of the biggest ringers the show has seen. It was MOST DEFINITELY time for someone else to win and most definitely time that Val leaves the show-just my opinion lol
Normani reminds me of Janel Parrish. Another one who got to the final based on hugely inflated scores and was saved by the immunity week.
Thanks for your usual excellent analysis. I fit the demographic of the average voter (except probably a little older and more liberal). From the start, Normani was, to me, just another ringer, and I definitely have an anti-ringer bias, unless and until that celebrity manages to come across as a real person. This never really happened for me with Normani. On the other hand, I loved Rashad from his first dance, and David quickly grew on me.
I totally agree with Sandy above: Val’s freestyle choreography had absolutely no “wow” factor. He would have benefitted from some outside help. Would a great freestyle dance have clinched the mirrorball for Normani? I don’t know, but it might have moved her up from third to second.
I was thrilled with the final results. They almost made up for all the crap that went on during the season. Almost.
I didn’t want Normani to win because Val is so arrogant and their dances didn’t wow much
There were others who were way better than her Rashad Simone…
I along with a lot of others wanted someone else to win who hadn’t so I’m glad Emma and Rashad got it although I would’ve taken David and Lindsay over Val any day
I always love your posts it’s obvious you’re truly committed to what you do
Also you remind me of my coworker telling it like it is and I’ll keep doing it no matter what anyone thinks
Great post with a lot of interesting information! I have to say that personally, this was the first season I ever actually voted. I voted for Simone the week of “Smiles don’t win you Gold medals” because I felt she was getting the short end of the stick in order to protect Normani and I voted for Rashad to win. The blatant producer manipulation and favoritism from the judges is what really got me to vote, but not in the direction they were hoping for, and I actually saw other people say the same. Also, whenever Normani spoke, it came off as very “pageant” to me. Meaning her answers and comments were calculated in a way like she was just saying what she thought the audience would want to hear or respond to. Seems like a nice enough girl, and a very good dancer, but she lacked a genuine quality that would make to want to root for her.
I never understand when people say “the best dancer should win” when if you look back to season 1 of this show, the best dancer didn’t win. Zendaya always annoys me, every single season that Val is in the finale she tweets something to the effect of not letting the apparent travesty of her not winning happen to someone else. She needs to move on, her career is exploding right now, probably more than any other DWTS contestant ever, she’s in the new Spiderman, and she just finished a movie with Zac Efron, which IMO is way better than a Mirrorball Trophy lol. I understand if she wants to support her former partner, but for goodness sakes LET IT GO GIRL!
I saw Mark Ballas did an interview with Mario Lopez on his radio show and Mario is clearly still salty that he didn’t win. Mark defended Rashad’s win and Mario kept saying how it’s a dance competition and how the best dancer should always win. I found this incredibly ironic because how many times has Mark actually had the best dancer but didn’t win? I guess for the trained dancers that do this show it’s a blow to their ego’s when they don’t win, but they should remember that this is a reality television show first, and a dance competition second.
I never thought Normani was getting the votes from day one. I am the demo audience and there was no connection to her personality or her music. I definitely think Nancy would have beaten her easily had they not given Normani immunity and quite frankly, that really pissed me off. The base of the show clearly related to & connected with Nancy and it isn’t smart to throw her out in order to keep someone who wasn’t a demo favorite. Also the fact that Normani couldn’t even get a paltry 3,100 votes in the final to pass Rashad tells me she was a low vote getter the whole season. Stupid producers.
Well done, Courtney!!! Fantastic analysis! To further prove your point, I’m in the heart of the demographic, save for the conservative part and although I thought Normani was a very sweet girl and quite a competent dancer, I never gave her one vote the entire season. She never inspired me and my votes went (consistently) to David & (occasionally to) Rashad. I’m a would be Chicagoan and David touched my heart with his loyalty, kindness and his constant effort and positive attitude to try anything (not to mention that I’ve begun to absolutely love & respect Lindsay’s creativity and talent with her partners), so he had my votes from the moment of his announcement. Rashad consistently evolved and improved, so that wins with me every time! I was indifferent to Simone and Normani. Simone was so good from the start (which was expected) but I found I never looked forward to seeing her dance week-to-week (and unfortunately part of my indifference is that I just don’t care for Sasha), she impressed week one but nothing changed after that, it became boring. Also, I really think her coming on immediately following Laurie’s win put her out of contention simply because we’d just seen all the same a few months previously and with someone with a more engaging countenance. That’s my two cents! I loved this post, it gave me a lot to think about and I really appreciate your thoroughness and point of view!
Excellent job, Courtney!! Love what all the mods have to say here.
I don’t know if the main demographic was aware that Val’s choreo wasn’t up to par or that his scores were inflated or perhaps non-deserving because of obvious mistakes or non-assigned or in correct choreo being over looked? Were they aware of Normani’s dance experience? Maybe the demo is more social media savvy now and didn’t fall for the manipulations?
I know it makes me more angry when the judges are nitpicky, mean and negative towards some (Simone/Nancy) but glowing reviews when it appears non-deserving (Val) I just ask for consistent and fair judging. (They seemed to judge evenly and positive on Monday which made me happy for everyone involved.)
Maybe voters also thought Val wasn’t deserving votes and they could see how hard Lindsay and Emma were working cohesively with their partners. Val’s freestyle compared to Lindsay and Emma’s is a good comparison. Val’s face at the end of the show and the way he pouted and related to Normani at the final minute was very telling compared to how happy and loving the other
Couples were.
Becs, Mario still bitter? Well, I always thought he was full of himself and fake which is why I would never vote for him and why I don’t vote for Val.
I also thought it was funny how Normani had to physically grab the mic from Tom on the last two shows to make sure she gets to talk before Val grabs the mic.
GREAT post Courtney! Thank you for laying it all out so clearly.
I’m already more interested in NEXT season and to see if this has any effects. Like will Emma get a partner again? And will he be another “hopeless” non-dancer or someone that just might have something like Rashad? Will Precious and Bro be gifted with a “great” partner again or will they perhaps favor someone else like Gleb, Artem, Keo or even Sasha. Will Louis (gag) ever return? How about Allison? Have the new head honchos learned anything?
And DWTS Jr. – Who will be the judges? Any former or current pros?
some interesting points on here. As someone that was rooting for Normani all season I have to admit I was not shocked that she didnt win (although I was a little disappointed).
After the first few weeks of the show I had a feeling the producers would want to keep Normani in till the finale and then throw her under the bus because 1. I dont think she could commit to the tour. 2. Shock value. 3. some controversy because of her dance experience. 4. Maybe she wasnt getting as many votes as people thought. 5. Normani and David have huge fan bases so they are good for views and hype and of course she is a killer dancer. So many non-regulars just watched the show for Normani (im sure that applies to so many others too but I dont know enough so I cant talk about anyone else).
In my opinion the main factor that I think hurt Normani was her freestyle. Its no secret that Normani would have KILLED an uptempo freestyle like she showed in some of her other dances. but Val/producers/whoever gave her a very forgettable performance to a horrible live rendition of the song. Her contemporary was a strong emotional performance so the freestyle just didnt live up to it or any of her other performances. She had big numbers and always pushed through them and always left an impression so to give her that choice hurt her. Normani was never their candidate to win. I think they hyped her so that people would get too distracted to notice who they really wanted to win.
They made it seem like Normani had it in the bag to surprise people when she didnt win. Rashad was definitely who they had in mind for the win (maybe not at the start but after a few weeks he became the one). Since week 1, he had the personality and he was lovable so that connected to so many people. He also had a good combination of what David and Normani had to offer.
I wish Normani had won and personally I think she deserved it but if it wasnt her then Im glad it was Rashad. Would have been ok with Simone too. Congrats to Rashad and Emma, worthy opponents and great winner’s story. Rashad will have the tour and so many more opportunities to explore his options and so will Normani so everything will work out for both. Also David seems happy to have gone further than he ever expected. I really respect and admire Lindsay for the work she put in with David.
Normani was the best dancer for this season. Some of you are saying she did not connect with people. Maybe it how they edited her package. Normani will always be a classy hard working girl. She does not need a mirror ball, although having it would have been nice. She came in third for X factor and she is more successful than who came first and second and I am sure history will repeat itself. I hope Rashad can finally get a job. I hate to see black men unemployed.
Thanks all for the kind words 🙂 Part of me only wrote this post because I felt like I was taking crazy pills these past few days, with all of the Harmonizers insisting that the show was “rigged/sexist/racist/etc.” and being completely ignorant of…well, facts. But I’m glad you enjoyed!
@Carol & Sandy – While I agree that Val did Normani no favors with that crappy (copied) freestyle, I don’t know that it really would have made much of a difference in the end – as I mentioned above, I think the root cause of Normani getting third was that she really wasn’t getting a ton of votes all season long. I don’t know that a dynamite freestyle would have changed that – she may have picked up a few votes here and there, but I doubt it would have changed the result. I’m not even sure she could have gotten past David to take 2nd – although the one benefit of her getting 2nd instead of 3rd is that we wouldn’t have had time for a huge pity party for her. She and Val would have gotten drowned out by the Rashad & Emma revelry.
@M8 – Yeah, Janel’s another you could compare Normani to. Although I think part of Janel’s staying power on the show had to do more with that stupid fauxmance she was peddling with Val than anything else – TPTB were eating that sh*t right up.
@Becs – Only fans of the best dancer on any particular season say “Well the best dancer should win!” Just like folks that are fans of someone like David say “It should be who had the most growth!” And I still see people throw out “Well fans should be voting for the celeb, not the pro!” in various scenarios to support their favorite. I think in the 8 years I’ve been blogging this show, the only thing I can say for certain is “There is no right or wrong way to vote.” I used to be the type that said “Well people should vote for the best!” but I’ve come to realize that everyone votes for different reasons – and that’s not likely to change, so I think the pros/celebs/audience/viewers/etc need to acccept it for what it is. I do get a good laugh out of hearing how salty Mario is about not winning TEN YEARS LATER. I thought Zendaya being bitter about something that happened 4 years ago was bad – but Mario gives “butthurt” a whole new meaning.
@Colleen – Only four times in DWTS history has a pro not returned to the show the season immediately after they won: twice it was Derek, and he had taken on other projects and opted to sit out DWTS; once it was Peta, because she was pregnant; the only other time was Kym not returning for season 10 after winning season 9 (and that season was a bit odd, anyway – they really trimmed things down, so who knows what happened there). Thus, I think as long as Emma WANTS to come back for season 25, there will be a spot for her. Now whether or not she’ll get a good partner, that remains to be seen – I could see them possibly reverting back to giving her duds again, because I’m not sure they intended for her to win this season. The only pro that consistently gets contenders is Val – and I’m glad other outlets are starting to notice. But because TPTB have an implicit obligation to hold a spot for Emma next season, I’m not sure that Allison and/or Jenna will have a spot waiting for them. I’m guessing that Nigel and/or the higher-ups at DWTS probably got tired of sharing their pros, and gave SYTYCD all-stars like Allison & Jenna an ultimatum: you either do spring season of DWTS OR you do SYTYCD this summer – you don’t get to do both. As for the Brothers – hehe, I wonder if Val’s gonna follow through on those “I may take next season off” claims, now that he doesn’t have MBT #3 😛 My guess is his schedule will suddenly be clear and he’ll return, to much fanfare on GMA *eye roll* Maks I’m not so sure about, because these past two seasons, he’s been pretty lackadaisical – like he could totally take or leave being a pro on DWTS. I do get the sinking feeling, however, that he may get tapped to be a judge on DWTSJ, and some murmurings behind-the-scenes make me wonder if both Chmerkovskiy brothers might have some kind of role on DWTSJ.
Wow, Ben, that last sentence doesn’t sound racist at all. *blink*
…and the whole “well Normani is super successful and Rashad doesn’t have a job” tack that so many Harmonizers seem to be taking just goes to show how classless the majority of Normani’s fanbase is. And seriously? You’re gonna try and claim that a girl group member from a reality show that’s only been around for a few years is MORE SUCCESSFUL THAN A WORLD-SERIES WINNING MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL PLAYER??? I want some of that crack you’re smoking, boo boo…
Yep, Normani’s a classy girl…with quite possibly the most classless fans I’ve encountered in 8 years of blogging this show.
Absolutely I think Normani not ever being in true jeopardy killed her Being granted immunity (which I don’t think is right It’s only TPTB saving who they want) when she probably would have been eliminated. That tells me she wasn’t getting votes all season Being a fan for many years it’s the well liked the one who has “a story” the most inspiring no dance experience that wins #Bindi It also means well liked pro #Derek As you said you have to get the average voter to vote for you & all season the judges gushed over her over scoring her which told the average voter she didn’t need votes
Great post Court, completely agree as usual. Those of us who have watched the show since season 1 can spot all of these things.
I’ve said it before- but I doubt now Val will take S25 off 🙁 With S26 airing TBD and not winning a 3rd Mirrorball this season, he won’t want to be gone from the regular show what could potentially be a very long time. I have a small glimmer of hope with more of the general public noticing Val favoritism this past season (it seemed that way) that TPTB might finally give him a non-contender in S25. But of course if there is still an agenda to make Val the top pro on DWTS, they might try to get him his 3rd Mirrorball before the DWTS Jr airs.
If both C Bros are heavily involved in DWTS Jr show my interest for it drops even more.
I’ll be totally honest. I won’t vote for Val regardless of who his partner is. I don’t even watch his dances, I just fast forward through every one. Didn’t see one Normani dance this season. Not even interested.
Another reason was I saw how rude and hateful Normani’s fans were. If she is reflection of her fans, then no thank you. I saw the worst comments I have ever seen from her fans. Threats of physical harm, cyber attacks, hacking, you name it!
Alright Courtney, i have to 2 questions for you. Kindly answer when you can.
1. How come the celebs who decides to tour wins? ie. Rumer, Laurie or Shad?
2. How come the show only had 1 black female winner (Amber) even though there have been numerous amazing black girls on the show who deserved to win in their seasons (ie. Mel B)?
So, are these all just mere coincidences?
Atleast not me.. as it smells manipulation from the racist/sexist showmaker’s end.
I know you rooted for Rashad & dint liked Normani for some reasons.. so you may not accept it. But still just think as a woman for once.. & you’ll feel too, that how sexist/racist the DWTS show makers are ..& they have wronged Normani just because she’s a black girl.
Anyways, it was nice being with ya’ll this season. Stay blessed. Take care.
Ah, vedy interesting about BOTH of the Chmerkovskiy’s possibly being involved in DWTSJ. I was particularly expecting Maks to be offered a seat at the judges table since, as you say, he seems ambivalent towards DWTS even while they seem to want him. And he did seem very interested in being a DWTS judge before. It would keep him on TV and provide a hefty pay check without the work involved in choreographing and teaching a celeb to perform. But it would be especially interesting if little bro has something going on with DWTSJ. It might be why he’s been saying that he won’t be on next season. But judge or something else? Surely not a producer! Host? I’ll laugh if he gets a seat on the judges table anywhere after insisting that he doesn’t see himself as a choreographer or dance show judge in 5 years! (I don’t either but for different reasons, I expect!)
Ok “Nice” Miriam (and I use those quotes for a reason), I have two answers for you:
1.) Alek Skarlatos went on tour after season 21, and he didn’t win – he got third. Hmmm. I know you Harmonizers just LOVE to cling to the notion that Rashad only won because he said yes to the tour, but here’s a newsflash: THE SHOW CANNOT RIG THE VOTES. They can’t just crown whoever they want as the winner – there are FEDERAL LAWS against tampering with the results of a competition television show where there is a cash prize, and if it were ever determined that the show somehow lied about the vote totals, there would be an astronomical lawsuit and somebody would be doing some jail time. On top of that, individual contestants could sue for breach of contract, thereby further increasing the trouble. Is it kind of a dick move for the show to announce who’s touring, and then announce the winner? Sure, I wish they wouldn’t do it. But let’s not pretend that Rashad would not have won if he wasn’t going on tour – he was Normani’s biggest competition for that trophy, and his phone line was busy for 20+ minutes after the show wrapped on Monday night.
2.) First, Mel B is a bad example to try and prove your case with, as her freestyle was awful and I remember quite a few people being bothered by her off-color sense of humor. Helio EASILY won his season because he was the only one that didn’t completely blow the freestyle round that year – Mel didn’t deserve to win after that garbage routine Maks gave her. And I’d love to know what your criterion are for “deserving” a win – because I’m guessing you’re going to say “well they were the best dancer”, and we’ve already pointed out that the best dancer doesn’t always win because there are other factors in play. And I feel like you didn’t even read my post, Miriam, because I gave SEVERAL plausible reasons that Normani didn’t win – none of which had to do with her gender or the color of her skin. I gave actual numerical data, and you’re setting up straw men about “why has only one black female won?” I’m not even going to bother looking up every black female contestant this show has ever had and give you some detailed explanation as to why they haven’t won, but off the top of my of my head:
Tamar Braxton – shit attitude, withdrew due to health issues
Brandy – pro gave her weak choreography, and she cried on camera nearly every week
Christina Milian – shit attitude, and wrong demographic for her music
Monique Coleman – wrong demographic (High School Musical), pro with boring choreography
Toni Braxton – boring, and her pro was boring too
NeNe Leakes – was not nearly as good as the Olympic figure skater on her season
Laila Ali – another blown freestyle courtesy of Maks, up against an Olympic gold medalist and a boy band member
Lil Kim – ex-convict, up against an Olympic gymnast and a former Dallas Cowboys cheerleader/Bachelor contestant
Mya – up against literally the biggest fanbase ringer the show has ever seen, and another crappy freestyle
Macy Gray – just a terrible dancer
Wendy Williams – also a terrible dancer
Zendaya – demographic issues, probably could have won if her fans hadn’t crashed the voting site
Lolo Jones – shitty dancer with an even shitter attitude
Patti LaBelle – couldn’t remember choreography to save her soul
Chaka Khan – also couldn’t remember choreography to save her soul
Kim Fields – mediocre dancer who played it wayyyy too safe
And don’t you dare tell me to “think like a woman” – I’ve been blogging this show for 8 years now, and while I agree that it can be sexist (particularly against the female pros, but not against the contestants, like you’re claiming in this instance), I’m not going to sit here and pretend that the show screwed Normani out of a win that she deserved just because she’s black. There’s a myriad of other, more valid reasons why she didn’t win, and crying “racist!” whenever you don’t get your way undermines actual instances of racism, Miriam.
I would about die of shock if I could find one Harmonizer that could gracefully accept that Normani didn’t win, and didn’t try to invoke the childish screeches of “THIS SHOW IS RACIST/SEXIST/RIGGED!!!”
It surprises me when people use the race card when things don’t go their way.
I did not vote for Normani because she was a black girl. I did not vote for her because she had a lousy PRO and her dancing was subpar. A shot of whiskey for every leg kick.
I didn’t vote for Rashad because he was a black man. I voted for him because I loved the way he danced and because of his chemistry with his humble hard working pro.
I threw some votes for David because he made me laugh or cry every week. He truly loved the experience and his pro.
Interesting read, as always, Courtney. This was a particularly ugly season and you Mods really had your hands full. Hope you all can take a breath now before WOD starts up.
Because of my ongoing family situation, I really didn’t have the opportunity to watch the live show all season. The two nights of the Finale were the first shows I watched in real time. I’ve watched about 50 percent of the dances online and watched a handful of the packages. I voted a bit for Nancy, Simone, David and Rashad early on; and the last 3 weeks I voted strictly for Rashad.
Like many here, I feel like Val did not put enough of the assigned content in Normani’s dances. I heard that the judges gave her a break at the beginning of the season on this issue because she was traveling with her group on tour. If that’s true, it infuriates me. If a celeb chooses to do the show while locked into many other commitments, that’s their problem, in my opinion. I have a greater appreciation for the celeb who basically puts his/her life on hold in order to concentrate on doing the best they can on the show.
From what I saw of her, Normani seems like a nice enough person. That said, as a self-professed long time viewer of the show, I think she should have called Val out on his lack of assigned content in the dances. The fact that she, apparently, didn’t put her foot down with him, so to speak, makes me think she was hoping to sort of skate by.
I’ve read a lot of the archived posts on this site; and I fully understand your point about contestants needing to win over the general audience/voting demo. That said, I’m still bitter and sad that Paige lost to Nyle in Season 22. I just don’t know what more she could have done to win over the voters. She was kind and sweet to everyone; always acknowledged her competition (even though they didn’t acknowledge her); she never made a face at her scores (even Guest Judge Maks and his petty 7 for her Rumba with Sasha); she didn’t let Mark’s injury and having to dance with Alan throw her and she took the sudden changes in music, dance style and choreography during famous Dances week in stride. She had the most varied, different looking dances and she had a great partnership with Mark. Unlike Ginger, she never hid her previous dance experience; and she had a lovely growth arc on the show. I’ll forever be shaking my head that more voters in the general audience/main demo didn’t find her likeable enough.
Very interesting post Courtney. I agree with all your points. I think TPTB figured out she wasn’t getting the votes to contend with the majority of those above her they decided she had to start winning people over with her “story”. That’s when her narrative began to reek of desperation because every week they trotted out Grandma, Hurricane Katrina, Cancer, Cyber Bullying, etc. I think a portion of the audience saw through that too. Had some of these parts of her “story” been touched on earlier on the show it might not have felt as manipulative as it did.
I also agree that there were the 3 different types of voter fatigue effecting her (and the other three women Heather, Simone and Nancy)
Also, the rabid fans did her no favors. I think Princess Heidi pointed out earlier that she might have picked up additional voters along the way if her fans weren’t so obnoxious and rude to everyone. I knew there was no way I was ever going to vote for her based on their behavior alone. I think they are as much to blame for her coming in third as they were in getting her to third (if that makes sense).
All the crying about her being the best dancer – I thought she was a good dancer but I don’t think she was the best technical dancer. I think Heather and Simone were better technically (although Heather was given lackluster choreography which I haven’t figured out if it was deliberate or if Maks was just that bad).
After Heather was out I voted Simone & Rashad. I thought they both worked hard, had great dancing and were not getting preferential treatment from the judges/producers.
As for the 5th Harmony fans’ excuses it does make me wonder what excuses they would have come up with had Simone won. Of course they can say now they would have been happy with Simone winning but I don’t think the majority would have been ok if that had actually happened.
Not that I think either C-bro should be on DWTSJ but that’s not a show I would watch regardless and if that gets them off the regular show, I’ll take it. I can actually see Maks being funnier and more entertaining to watch with kids than Val, especially with Val’s civil trial for humiliating a child and attacking her mother coming up. Not good pr for a kids show.
Personally, I think Val not touring this summer & setting the table now by saying he may take next season off is entirely due to his civil suit. He has an exhibit & witness list due this July & Val’s case was set for a jury trial for 7/10/2018. Now amended pleadings are due by this August and motions are due by 1/30/18. You have to act like you will take it all the way to trial in hopes your opponent wears down & caves but Val does not want this to get to an actual jury trial & be in the news & what he did & said about the girl and to her mother all over tv. Can you imagine!? It would play on the entertainment news everyday. I think he wants to quietly be out of the spotlight this summer and next season to settle the case at the lowest possible amount before ever going to a jury trial & then come back & hope the public doesn’t catch on.
Maybe these harmonizers will find something constructive to do with their time this weekend and take a moment to honor our veterans for their service to our country.
Happy Memorial Weekend everyone!
I know my father is no longer with us but he proudly served in the Marines during the Korean conflict so this weekend is dedicated to him in our household. Thank you Dad, we love you!
@Sandy you’re giving the Harmonizers FAR too much credit!
Thankful for your Dad’s service! My Father is a Vietnam War Vet who served from 1967-1969! He’s 75, just had open heart surgery 17 days ago but is recovering fairly well. Enjoy your weekend!
Thanks so much for this well-written post, Courtney! Maybe some of the Harmonizers, who are probably mostly new to the show, can find some “peace” with your well-reasoned explanations for Normani’s 3rd place. I think Normani is a very sweet, talented girl, but her partnership with Val never clicked for me and other celebs and couples were simply more appealing to me (Rashad and Simone mainly, although Lindsay’s choreo and David’s enthusiasm were amazing to watch as well). I agree that we didn’t really get to know Normani, partly because of Val’s constant talking when they were interviewed (it absolutely annoyed me). I also wonder how the focus on Val comes across to the general audience and whether the talking back to the judges after their salsa put them off as well.
Accusations of racism or sexism should be directed at actual instances of that. The show has had great dancers, female and male, white people and people of color, who didn’t win. Systemic problems in society that involve racism, sexism or ageism should always be addressed and solved, but throwing out an “-ism” whenever people don’t feel like looking for explanations, looking up facts and using basic logic only weakens the position and the arguments of those who really are victims of these problems. Saying Normani wasn’t a victim of racism or sexism on the show doesn’t mean that she wasn’t a victim of that another point in time or that these problems don’t exist.
The “best dancer should win”-argument has never made sense to me. Then we could just hand the trophy to the person who has the most dance experience coming into the competition, since they’re most likely going to be the best dancer. DWTS has never been a real ballroom competition – if it was, then we wouldn’t have 50-year-old celebs compete against 20-year-old girl group members or amputees compete against olympians. The winner always is someone who is likeable AND a good dancer, but being technically perfect just doesn’t cut it for an entertainment show (that would have been Heather for me anyway, but I never really got to know her either). This is why pros who understand the entertainment aspect of the show seem to have more success. I think Derek, Lindsay and Kym are the best examples of using their creativity to produce interesting routines for partners of different abilities while always keeping the focus on their partners and being fun to watch on and off the floor – to me, they’re the most consistent at that.
#30, Sandy thank you for reminding us of all who have sacrificed so much. There is a long history of service in my family- from WWI, WWII, Korea, and Nam and I am grateful to be free to enjoy the gifts they have given us.
Enjoy the weekend, Everyone, and let’s take a break from this stuff. Much more pleasant things to do with family, friends, neighbors.
Your fav wins some years and doesn’t other years. That’s the way it goes. I’m still sad that Hinch did not win because he blew me away. I mean a race car driver that had never danced or performed and he just lit up the screen every week.
Rashad and David just stood out to me from the beginning. There is nothing like seeing a celeb really embrace the experience and improve from week to week. I was sad when Nancy left because she also embraced the experience and gave us some really good dances. Additionally all three had Pros that taught them and provided interesting choreography Have to add Simone and Sasha to that list too.
Normani just seemed the same to me from beginning to end. Good dancer but no change from week to week. Plus I did not appreciate the judges raving on how fantastic she was and never pointing out that her Pro was not choreographing the given dance style. Then there was that catsuit for the last quickstep.
Rashad and David brought a lot of joy to their performances and journey and in the end that’s what I voted for.
I think the major factor why Normani didn’t win is because of Val fatigue. The guy wears me out, on top of getting on my nerves constantly. Of course the crappy freestyle didn’t help. I read either here in the comments or on another site that it was actually Alan that choreographed the Val/Normani freestyle. If true, Val couldn’t even muster up the effort to choreograph an important freestyle for the finale. I also read where a couple of Val/Mak’s friends (Alex and J.T.) got on twitter and griped that America did not know how to vote, who the winner’s were, and that Val/Normani were the real deserving winners. You can’t tell me that they didn’t do this without the C-Bros blessing. The “fam” that consists of Maks, Val, Peta, Sharna, & Jenna did not even get on twitter and congratulate Emma/Rashad like other pro dancers did.
Wow! Courtney, another great write-up. If the Harmonizers (or anyone still doubting the results) still don’t get it, I don’t know what will. They will definitely make up other reasons to explain why the results turned out the way they did to suit their own set beliefs.
The show may be sexist (to a certain degree), but racist? Not really. To my knowledge, it has tried to cast celebs from different ethnic/racial backgrounds.
When Normani was given immunity, I felt then that she was not really getting enough votes, pretty much like what happened to Janel. Funny how both were partners of the most coddled pro and both ended in 3rd place in their respective seasons. There’s a pattern.
Great post Courtney and I agree. I had nothing against Normani, but I’m extremely glad she didn’t win. I went on twitter right after the announcement and I have to say that those harmonizers were mean, nasty and rude. A lot said the show is going to be cancelled because none of us are ever watching it again. Well, the show was fine before you started watching and it will continue after you stop. The whole racist thing, to me, is what people fall on when they don’t have anything else to use. She also was, unfortunately for her, stuck with a partner that has become extremely unlikable and right there she losing votes. I just wish this group knew the meaning of being a gracious loser.
I wasn’t planning on watching DWTSJ, but @MariaD, I agree. If it gets Maks and Val off this show, go for it. I would like to say that he should never have been on this season because of the civil trial he has on his head and that should also keep him off a show where he would deal with children. I also agree that chances are he will sit out next season to keep a low profile. Maybe that’s how he had this season. TPTB let him on with the agreement that we’ll get you to the finals but then you’re gone until all of that is cleared up. I’m sorry, but he just needs to call it a day and TPTB need to cut him loose.
Emma, Sasha and Lindsey should be on the list of returnees. They’ve proven they’re capable of great choreography, they showcase their partners and they don’t feel entitled to camera/speaking time when they’re with Erin. Emma had me in tears when she said she didn’t know if she would ever have this again. Let’s hope TPTB see what they have in her and not give her an “early out.”
Great season of posts from everyone and thank you mods for doing all the work. I look forward to seeing all of you back when the rumors start circulating on what celebs and pros will be on.
Since you mentioned voter fatigue, do you think that this the end of the manipulation working on people? Or is it hard to tell since there were so many factors going into Normani not winning this season?
If Normani did an all star season do you think she would win, place worse or place the same?
@jada – Given that everyone on the all-star season except Melissa Rycroft finished worse than they did on their original season, I’m guessing Normani, too, would do worse – but I don’t think there’s ever going to be another all-star season, so I doubt it’s something worth seriously contemplating or hoping for.
Great comments! Grateful to those who slog through twitter/fb/ig et al & share here. I choose to not spend time with all that. So TY.
Have always felt DWTS was a multi purposed vehicle. Yes, it is a light hearted form of entertainment watching people learn dance, but TPTB began by enlisting “B” grade or forgotten Stars to possibly reboot careers. And some successes have occurred.
Mario Lopez whining about the MBT 10 years later gave me a huge laugh. That man has been steadily employed (his NBC job nets 3.5M/yr) plus endorsement deals/radio shows/etc. How can he possibly complain? He is arguably one of the biggest reboots they’ve had.
For me, even though the relationship between Mario & Karina was real & lasted beyond the show, I did not want to see it. This was a professional relationship. Karina was being paid to teach. Like any professional, she should have waited til after the show to make it personal. So I did not vote for them. They violated MY standards.
As for Normani, while she is young she has had quite a bit of life experience and knows how to market herself. (as opposed to Simone & Sadie) I cannot tell you how disappointed I was about her pitching a FAKE relationship with Bonner just for his voters. Sorry, Harmonizers, but this makes your girl a LIAR.
Yes, this may have happened at Val’s suggestion but it was not victimless fun.
Bonner seemed to believe it was real & at least twice asked her out during an interview. Mani’s response (after she lost) and was asked about dating Bonner? “Oh, I did say that.” What a disingenuous, cold hearted move from someone so young. TPTB should be ashamed of airing that crap & I hope Bonner calls the show out for it.
What a great post and soo much thought put into it. I think it doesn’t matter how much proof and facts you put out there for the Harmonizer fans, they are going to believe what they want to believe. I will say this to those fans, before DWTS, i never even knew who Normani or 5th Harmony was. I may be in the middle age range, but when i told my younger co-workers, 20 somethings who really don’t watch the show that Normani from 5th harmony was competing, they said who? So she wasn’t as popular as you think. I once actually liked Val till i tired of his same old same old tired choreography and dead on RINGERS he always got. Never having to work hard as the other female Pros getting NON-DANCERS. I actually was a Bachelor nation fan and i voted for Nick while he was on. I was a fan of the Bachelor and it was MY right to vote for who i wanted. After my favorite was eliminated i didn’t go blow up twitter and insult everyone who didn’t vote for him, i turned my votes over to who i thought was deserving, and that was Rashard. Grow up harmonizers, stop the racist comments which takes away from real racist issues in our world. Its a damn tv show for Gods sake. If a tv show affects you like this, then you have some REAL mental/anger issues.
Great post, Courtney, and I agree with all 7 of your points on why Normani didn’t win.
I will add that I think there are many viewers who have watched the show from its early seasons who still love the “no-dance skills celeb with great personality discover their NATURAL ability throughout the season.”
The only legitimate complaint Normani’s fans have is that it should have been about Normani and not Val.
And I had to think back to how I voted in terms of Val’s other partners.
I didn’t vote for Tamar because her attitude drove me nuts but I DID toss Ginger and Laurie some votes up until the final.
I think I might have given a few votes to Normani if we hadn’t had so many GOOD celebrities AND more importantly had the Harmonizers NOT BEEN so totally obnoxious to DWTS viewers. Honestly? THAT MORE THAN VAL turned me off from Normani who is a MILLION TIMES CLASSIER than her fans.
@ Darlene #35. To be fair Sharna sent congrats but your right, none of the others did. Thought it was really unprofessional of PETA asking people to vote for Val. You didn’t see Sasha asking people to vote for Emma because he is too professional to do that.
Not sure if you noticed but Val unfriendly Emma, Lindsay and Witney on Instagram. Loser.
Nobody can cry racism as a black man won. If your cry that a black woman hasn’t won that’s not racism it’s sexism. And as more females have won than males the argument falls apart.
People who cry the best dancer should have won – Normani wasn’t the best dancer anyway, probably not even the second best.
If you look at it like this DWTS is a dance competition not a dancer competition. It no use Normani being a good dancer if she is given substandard dances to perform. In the end Rashad scored the highest scores in the final and his voting lines were in meltdown for some time after the show ended. His freestyle was legendary and truly brilliantly choreographed all season by Emma who promoted her celebrity and not herself. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see why he won.
Fantastic post by the way Court, #incitful
Re: DWTS Jr, not in favor of the C-bros influencing America’s youth in any form.
Maybe Dance Mom could do it from jail?
@Jamie – I do know that Emma posted a short video of a small celebration where Elena (Glebs wife) made her a cake congratulating her win. Mark and his wife were there as well as Keo and Artem just to name a few. So while some may not have posted on twitter, some of their friendships seem to be strong enough that they can personally send their well wishes.
Great post! Love how deep you went wih the analysis of her placing third.
I think the TPTB’s relationships with certain pros could have played a part…microscopic at best…but still a part.
I think TPTB kind of felt fed up with Maks and Val this season. They kind of took things into their own hands, talking about Alan being a pro numerous times, hogging the mic, returning from and injury on their terms (something tells me he could have returned earlier TBH but complete speculation), etc.
Maybe TPTB wanted Val to win initially, but realized he’s slippin out of the tour and then planning to take next season off…what if he plans to leave on a high note/win permanently or switches to another network. Im kind of over the whole Maks and Val show and want DWTS back…which is what I kind of saw in the last week of the show.
Looking forward to next season. I am glad Rov Wade is gone. Not happy with the apparent budget cuts I noticed earlier on in the season…but American Idol explains it.
@Carol – That made me LOL. Maks might not be too bad as a judge. I think being a father has tamed him a little bit.
The thing with Maks & Val is that it is always about them. They are so conceited that they never present their partner. For them the celeb is just there to make them look better. How many times during Heather’s segments did she make a joke about it always being about Maks. I know it was a joke but at the same time it wasn’t just a joke, it was true. A good deal of airtime on the first episode was spent with him talking about Peta & the baby. Ok. Then he gets injured & it was all about him. Understandable. His story still dominates all of her packages except the most memorable year. By the time he was back he had time to choreograph a forgettable jazz routine for a person who should have knocked it out of the park. I still can’t determine if he gave her easy stuff so she didn’t look like such a pro out of he gate then decided to finally start giving her decent choreo when it was too late. I can’t help but to wonder if she would have done better with Gleb or Artem.
As for Normani I am sure she would have done well with another partner but honestly I don’t know if she would have reached the finals with someone else. I don’t say that because I think she isn’t a good dance. I say that because I truly think that her scores were inflated and that she wasn’t getting the votes that her fans thought she was. No one has been able to come in with their own fans & win on that alone. None of them have that clout. I doubt that TPTB would have fallen all over themselves to promote her if she were paired with someone else. BTWI looked up her comments about dating Bonner & sure enough it sounds like she is backing out. Isn’t that real sweet?
As to whether this is the end of manipulation, I don’t think so. Reality shows are always subject to some level of manipulation but I think they will probably dial it down a little on the next season. I think now they might have realized how transparent they were.
@ Jamie #45. Yeah, sorry about that. I did not see Sharna’s post congratulating Emma/Rashad when I looked, but I will look again. IIRC, wasn’t Lindsay and Witney and even Jenna originally from the Hough/Ballas crowd before joining DWTS? Not sure about Emma. But what I am saying is, they did a lot of training and competition under the guidance of Mark’s dance company (or something like that) that he has in Utah and Derek and Mark helped them get interviews with DWTS for a job on the show. With Val’s rather weird obsession with Derek, I wonder if that is why he unfriended them. And I thought he said he was particularly close to Emma. He’s got a funny way of showing his closeness to her. I think it is safe to say Val can be called a fair weather friend. I am sure none of these girls are losing sleep over Val’s childishness.
Thank you for taking the time to break this down for us.
Other than not being politically conservative (I’m a liberal Catholic white chick in an interracial relationship of over 20 years), I’m a key demographic for this show.
I also have many, many years of being a dance enthusiast who has driven 12 hours to NYC to see NYCB dance Balanchine. I’m also a childhood student of ballet and with my husband,a student of ballroom, until his hips started to revolt.
Normani is a very accomplished and precise dancer, but I never felt an emotional connection to her. Great dance is not just about performing the steps correctly, it’s also about making a successful connection between steps, musicality and emotion. It’s a visceral art form. It’s skill enhanced by emotion. The potential was most definitely there, but Val never seemed to push his choreography and teaching to the level of potential that Normani had. He failed her, rather than the other way around.
Sandy, just replying to a post from Darlene who said the FAM haven’t wished Rashad and Emma congrats and I said Sharna had. Mark, Derek, Witney, Lindsay, Gleb, Keo, Sash, Artem, Kym have all sent good wishes. It is just noticeable who hasn’t
Found Emma’s instagram. Looks like Hayley and Willow were involved as well. Glad Emma has such good friends.
I’ll also add that when Courtney lays it all out one thing becomes abundantly clear – the C Bros lose trophies with shit choreography.
Playing the race/gender card is just moronic (and Childish) in the extreme in this instance – Rashad is a black man AND many women have won this show many times.
If you’re SO worried about women on this show, you are focusing in the wrong damn place – you need to be paying attention to the female pros and what goes on with Val. Until you start posting about this every season, you ain’t got a leg to stand on and your argument is shit.
I dunno, Maria_D, he’s just the type of asshole that wants it to be heard loud and clear that he’s not liable. And he’s probably not, we’ll see. That doesn’t mean he wasn’t an asshole and completely wrong for what he did – but it might not be actionable. I don’t know. But someone as arrogant as he seems to be probably wants his hearing loud and clear.
A classy, nice man would just admit he made a horrible mistake and move on.
The “Fam” behaves that way nearly every season that one of them doesn’t win – utterly classless and tasteless, not to mention sore-ass losers. They were absolutely vile and disgusting when Zendaya lost – even the DWM account was vile.
Darlene, Derek has said multiple times that he is particularly close with Emma – don’t know about Val. Val seems to unfriend everyone who congratulates the winner. With how he and Maks talk about family, maybe he sees it as disloyal.
I see that whole sort of mentality as OTT and ridiculous.
Ever since Maks had his famous fight with Len, and Maks saying this was HIS show that I have soured on the Chmerkovskiys. That was back when Hope Solo was his disasterous partner, one that Maks wanted and actively recruited. Hope is no picnic, and a nasty piece of work in her own right, but what the camera caught on tape should have been enough to get rid of him. Sorry but Maks is not a good teacher role model for anyone.
It was the one time that I thought Maks lost it and it wasn’t show anger, it was real and it was pretty ugly.
Now Val now has been the boisterous one this season but for me this is all for show and it’s kind of all who cares? anymore…this kind of bitchin’ has all been done before, not unlike Lacey Schwimmer when she talked back to Len during her season with Lance Bass, or when Tony barked at Carrie Ann and brought her the ballroom rules book, and Maks of course when he manages to be controversial every season. Where are they now? They have become nothing but bit characters on a show that some think back with fondness, others, not so much. Val shedding a few tears after the freestyle, is maybe him seeing some of the writing on the wall, he was probably encouraged by the showrunners to be abrasive and the show got their money’s worth, but in the end it makes him unlovable, and whether Val’s own personality gets in his way or if the showrunners push it, he doesn’t see a bright future with the show.
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I could be wrong, but I got the impression many of Normani fans are outside the US. I saw a lot of activity from Brazilian fans. I think it appeared they were numerous because they’re so vocal on SM (and rude).
I’m actually quite shocked Val didn’t publicly congratulate Emma and Rashad, or Lindsay and David for that matter. Maks has been a terrible influence on him. Notice how even Peta isn’t allowed to congratulate “the other side” anymore.
Derek and Mark are particularly close to Emma and used to compete against each other in Britain when they were young. I read somewhere that Emma’ main teacher was Shirley Ballas so they are very close friends.
I would love to see Derek and Mark back. If the new producers want creativity BallasHough dish it in spades
The youth demographic doesn’t vote. At least in any substantial way. It’s been proven over and over ever since Monique Colemen was on back in Season 3. I am not sure why the show keeps pushing them because people aren’t that impressed with little known young’uns and the ratings still tank in the 18-49 share.
I think that continuous manipulation in favor of Normani and Val made their fans believe they were both very good and had connection with the viewing audience.
Without manipulation they would have left long before the finale – it looks like helping Noramani reach finals is backfiring – if that will result in fewer manipulations (I am not hopeful), then that would be a good thing.
I have to admit I never thought Zendaya would win her season, especially towards the end of the season. Val was getting fatigued and the choreo was getting less and less interesting, her freestyle was subpar especially compare to the competition.
But even aside from that, Kellie was a pretty much perfect fit with the show’s demographic and combined with her good personality, compelling story and Derek’s choreo she was as mush a shoo-in to win as possible.
@Jamie – I didn’t know that Shirley Ballas was once Emma’s dance instructor.
Oh, and to touch on Val once again…. The really sad part of this court case is not only the initial action, BUT allegedly that the little girl’s mother emailed Val for 3 days asking him to take down the photo. Finally he obliged but only after giving her criticism by allowing her daughter to get that way. (or something to that affect). So blaming her.
@ Sandy #64….I remember Mark saying a few years back on DWTS that his mom (Shirley) had all of the pro dancers as her students (including the C-Bros, I bet that was a challenge, ha!) at one time or another in their careers. He was pretty proud of her and rightfully so. I would love for Shirley to replace any of the judges we have now, but now that it has been announced that she will be a judge on Strickly Come Dancing in England, that is probably not a possibility now.
When you have been on the show as long as Val, and worked with the other pros for years, it speaks volumes about your personality to not congratulate the winner. It’s not classy and it’s not smart. Fans notice and don’t like it, you start to lose popularity and votes, TPTB start to realize you’re not all that and pretty soon your not the pet pro. Val needs to wise up and grow up. I’ll never understand why they favored and pushed him so much but that might be ready to stop.
Normani was definitely hurt by the main demographic probably never having heard of her and so many other stars this year that fit their favorite type.
Mini rant-2 1/2 hour finale, filled with mostly crap, but about 10 seconds with the winners and no time for 2nd place at all! Of course we had a little time for Normani & Val.
Great post. If you have been watching the show for some time you would know all these reasons are on point. Demographics is so important!
And re: the winners that have gone on tour and comment #23 maybe implying that it is not coincidence. Well I don’t think it is, but not because the show is fixed and they rigged the voting. The producers know how many votes each contestant gets every week. They have been watching the trends, who gets more votes, who gets less for 6-7 weeks or so before they start asking celebs to come on tour. By that time they probably have a very good idea who is getting he votes and who is struggling and they probably ask the person who is killing it in votes (who logically has a higher possibility of winning).
I made a similar post on my Facebook two days after the final. These are most of the same reasons I wrote about. No one commented, so I guess they all thought I was right! 🙂
One point of contention, I think Edyta has the worst track record of a female pro, but Emma is definitely up there!
Hope, Emma has a very good track record considering the partners she’s been given, you try getting bill engvall to the finals
A little late reading this (we have a remodel going on), but an excellent post. Particularly liked points 5. and 7. I understand numbers, and eagerly await Heidi’s analysis during the season. And 7. says that you can’t fool people all the time!
*wide eye emoji* Mmmkay
*Sprinkles positive vibes*
I’m glad she did it. As a 20yr old DWTS fan who was probably more like you guys than anyone of these ‘end of career let me do DWTS to re-brand myself’ celebs that you prefer. All she wanted out of it was a chance at something she’s been going on about for years (she said it in an interview 2yrs ago).
She’s literally one of you, a fan of a show who by situation and circumstance was offered a chance to dance on her favourite show only to be hated by her fellow DTWS fans. If you stepped outside of your hate for the fandom and for Val you’d realise that your hating on her for being sent to dance and music class by your parents when she was little (like any parent with means and opportunity), because her day job includes some of the worst choreography know to man (it is so bad fans beg for a new choreographer) seriously, go watch their performances…it’s atrocious.
Glad she did it anyway, harmonisers really lots her years ago when Mani became so disconnected from the fandom, really sheltered and shy and had issues with confidence since she joined 5H. That cyber bulling started long before last year, but she’s smiled through it till it became too over whelming.
I get that you never connected to her but even the coldest of heart would have seen that the girl that looked so out of place at the cast introduction, never expected to get past week one and didn’t really expect harmonizers to support her because they never have became so comfortable in her own skin by the GMA after party. For TGP to not support a young woman finding her confidence over a hunky football player using the platform to as a stepping stone to regenerate his career…..I’m ok with my girl blossoming.
Some Harmonizers can be messy but so can some DWTS fans but you are both extremely dedicated. I’m just happy Mani opened up even just a little, she is a huge goofball really funny super cute and really complex but you’ll only see that side of her if she feels comfortable in that environment. I just hope all the DWTS fan hate doesn’t send her right back into her shell.
And Mani really did like Bonner. She’s said on two interviews that they are both busy but both from Texas so it will definitely happen but when they both have time. Bonner is the one that said asked her out out of duress and has been on several dates (with outer women) since.
Oh see, we turn our backs in the off season and the little Normani trolls sneak back in with cries of “hate” – grow up, honey. We’ve never “hated” Normani and only a child comes to that conclusion.
Congrats, Harmonizers – you’re officially the most insecure fanbase in DWTS history.