Dancing with the Stars Season 22, Week 5 – Dancing by the Numbers
Okay, once again Von and Antonio have exactly the same score. Am I supposed to believe this is coincidence?? And in WHAT universe is Paige a point behind Ginger? One where Black Hole Asshattery Judging (tm Susan1) rules the day– that universe.
Oy veh. El stupidos know not what they do…or they do and they don’t care because they WANT a “shocking” elimination. They improved Jodie’s and Kim’s position – but not by enough for it to possibly matter!! And in the process they put a few more people at risk. When just looking at the leaderboard, it looks fairly innocuous.
But then you start looking at the matchups and you can see quickly where a big problem might arise. Low man on the totem pole was Doug, who has survived all the way to week 6, so clearly he has something going for him. He’s a beloved sports figure. The only problem I see is that he doesn’t seem to be having fun. People might not vote for you if you don’t seem like you really want to be there. But if they ARE voting for Doug, we could be in for a surprise come Monday night. Why? Check it:
Now, you might think that 13.5k between Doug and Kim is a good number for Kim…and maybe it is. I don’t know. But if Doug IS killing it, look at how close together Kim, Von, Antonio and Jodie are!!
Ho-LEE crap. Kim, Von, Antonio and Jodie are all within less than 4k of each other. IF Doug is doing really well – well enough to pass any of these folks – Jodie may be in deep do do. Why Jodie? Well, how many obvious signals does one need to realize that people may not be voting for her?? In jeopardy two weeks in a row and then Maks’ crack about her reminding him of Sabrina – Sabrina the very talented dancer who was a shocking elimination not once but TWICE!! She could be in trouble.
But first, let’s back up and narrow the folks in danger a bit. First, one more table:
Now, I think that Nyle, Ginger, Paige and Wanya are safe. Doug needs more than at least 20k to get past any of them. On top of that, because they’re at the top of the leaderboard, EVERYONE else would have to get past Ginger and Nyle. I find this to be unlikely – this week. As for Paige and Wanya, even if Doug is getting past them, I very much doubt that all four of Kim, Jodie, Von and Antonio are – but this is why this week is risky. Look at those numbers! For Paige to be eliminated, ALL of the following would have to happen:
- Doug would have to get 25.2k more votes per million votes cast than Paige, AND;
- Kim would have to get 11.2k more votes per million votes cast than Paige, AND;
- Von AND Antonio would have to get 10k more votes per millon votes cast than Paige, AND;
- Jodie would have to get 8.5k more votes per million votes cast than Paige, AND;
- Wanya would have to get 3.4k more votes per million votes cast than Paige, AND;
- Paige would have to NOT get the votes she would need to get past Ginger and Nyle.
These are not big numbers, with the exception of Doug’s – but even those aren’t huge. All that said, I think Paige is going to be okay this week. I think there is at least one person who isn’t doing as well as her and that’s all it takes.
So, if Paige, Ginger, Nyle and Wanya are safe, that leaves us with Doug, Kim, Von, Antonio and Jodie. I *think* that Von and Antonio both have another week in them, thanks to their football fans. Kim needs less than 2k to get past one or both of them, but I just don’t know if that’s going to happen. I don’t think it is. Yet.
That leaves us with Doug, Kim and Jodie…and the news ain’t good. As you see up in table 2, IF Doug, Kim and Jodie are the ones in danger, Doug needs ONE of the following things to happen in order to be safe:
- Doug needs about 13.5k more votes per million votes cast than Kim, OR;
- Doug needs about 16.8k more votes per million votes cast than Jodie.
It’s always possible he getting the votes to put someone else in danger from the people above him, but I think Kim and Jodie are the two most likely at this point.
So, let’s say he makes it. Table 3 tells us what it will take for Kim to be safe. She needs ONE of the following things to happen. Just ONE and she’s safe:
- Kim needs for Doug to NOT get the 13.5k more votes per million votes cast than her, OR;
- Kim needs to get 1,700 more votes per million votes cast than either Von or Antonio, OR;
- Kim needs to get 3,400 more votes per million votes cast than Jodie, OR;
- Kim needs to get 8,500 more votes per million votes cast than Wanya…and so on.
I don’t think she’s probably getting past either Von or Antonio, like I said, but I would not be at all surprised to see her beat Jodie. Both are stars from iconic shows. While Jodie might be a bit more current, she’s dancing with Keo who (IMO) will have a tough time against Sasha. I think Sasha is getting some of Derek’s fans. Other than that, I think the two women are fairly equal on paper. The fact that they keep begging people (essentially) to vote for Jodie, it seems she needs help. The question is…did it work??
Something else to consider is that Jodie dance a very good dance with Val this past week – his fans may or may not be smart enough to vote for GINGER and not Jodie just because he danced with her. I’m going to lean towards not. I just don’t know if it will be enough. AND, the judges spoke very kindly to Doug, while Maks shredded Keo (insecure, Maks?) and Sasha – I suspect that they got some additional votes because of that shredding.
I still think it will come down to Doug and Jodie. Based on the judges overall tone when scoring Doug versus Kim and Jodie, I’m leaning toward that influence, plus the votes he needs to get past Jodie and Kim, as being too much for him.
I’ve rewritten this part twice now, but I’m going to lock it in as Doug being the one eliminated on Monday night. What do you think?
Then there’s the possibility of Jodie having to withdraw if her ankle injury is serious.
Thanks for the trademark!?
I’m hoping you’re right and Keo’s reaming out by Len Jr. (Maks), and Kim’s uncomfortable and somewhat bewildered face during it will have motivated some more people to vote for her.
I think Doug is at the limit of what he can do. I also don’t enjoy seeing a basically decent human being raked over the coals by the idiots week after week. So for his own sake, I’m hoping Doug is eliminated.
As much as Doug and Karina are my team, I think it might be his time because, like you said, it just doesn’t seem like he’s having fun. BUT it DOES seem like he’s working at it so I’d be more than fine if he stays. The one I wish would go is the one who doesn’t want to do the work but I agree it’s not his time yet because of his fans.
I don’t take that into consideration, since it’s not a reflection of the numbers.
Unless Jodie is injured bad enough to drop out. I agree it will be Doug. The scoring stunk on Switch Up Week. Maks annoyed me. Ugh.
This is one of my favorite features of this site, so thanks! I was absolutely convinced that Doug was going home but, although I still think its him, your numbers clearly laid out some interesting alternatives.
Personally, I am concerned about Kim a little. I think she and Sasha are an awesome couple but I worry that they are just flying under the radar- a point a lot of commenters here have made. I hope that the tongue lashing Keo got motivated some people to vote for her. I am also interested to see how Von does in the coming weeks. He is a contestant that I am really starting to enjoy, but another one that hasn’t really, IMO, had a breakout performance. Bing has listed him as “in danger” or “will be eliminated” the last three weeks. I know their model is suspect, but I do wonder if three football players combined with Witney’s lackluster choreo may be hurting him in votes.
I think it will be Doug. As much as I admire him personally, I do think that is the right outcome. I wouldn’t be mad though if it were Antonio. There is always someone who is sent home way before they should be. Even if they weren’t good enough to win, they were better than some that stayed. I hope that Kim and Jodie both are there another 2 or 3 weeks.
My head says it will probably be Doug (and TBH it probably should be, just purely from a technical viewpoint)c but my heart says he might be getting more votes than we think and I am probably most worried about Kim, even more so than Jodie. Oh how I wish it would be truly shocking and be AB…LOL!
Any idea on when a double elimination might come along? Won’t they have to do one at some point?
I know Doug has made it this far but even though we’re headed into Week 6 there have only been three eliminations. The first two gone were pretty far below everyone else on the leaderboard and he didn’t have to do much to get past Marla. Monday’s results will be very telling as to how many votes Doug is really getting because now HE’S the one kind of far below everyone else.
Kim is the other person I’m mainly worried about. Most people I’ve seen seem to like her but I’m not sure if she’s a lot of viewers’ #1 priority and she’s certainly not TPTB’s. I want to see her stick around but not sure it’s in the cards.
Antonio and Von are next-lowest on the leaderboard but they should be fine. If Antonio’s true colors are shown again on Monday I think he might be leaving us Week 7 though.
I’m somewhat concerned for Jodie because of the Sabrina Bryan comment and her back-to-back appearances in jeopardy. However, the Facebook crowd (my current measuring tool for the general audience) seems to really like her. Like, I see more excitement surrounding her on there than I do for Wanya or Paige, which is…interesting. It could mean nothing though. Regardless, I THINK she will make it through provided she does not have to drop out but her leaving on Monday is certainly possible, of course. And if she does have to drop out, I think they will still go ahead with an elimination on Monday because I saw the Week 10 Night 1 show is only an hour long which points to a 3-couple finale meaning they have to get rid of six couples in four weeks.
Thanks Heidi. Good job again!!! And I’m with you as well. Sadly, I think it might be Doug to go as well.
I feel fairly confident it will be Doug. However, if that happens what this post shows is that if the judging continues down this path it could really be up in the air in the coming weeks. It seems that Jodie’s the next logical one given the scores and the fact that she’s been in jeopardy some. But it still feels like there are actually a good amount of people who could leave in the next couple weeks.
Thanks, PH! I love the numbers post you do every week! It’s fascinating to read what you have uncovered! I’m going to go with Jodie going home. I think Doug might be getting enough votes to get by her. It’s probably wishful thinking on my part, but I’ll stick with that choice. I am worried about Kim as well, but I think because Kim is always so upbeat with Sasha and Jodie is less so with Keo, I think people are drawn to vote for her between the two of them. How is that for unscientific!!! … and that’s why we really need your numbers post! 🙂
Doug will go home then Kim after him. Since we have NO clue as to how the public votes we can only go by the judges scores.
I think it will be Doug also, but I would love Antonio to go. I don’t like that they add the scores from the switch up dance to the couples scores from the week before. Those scores shouldn’t be considered. Skip the week of having someone eliminated, but next week just have it based on the scores received with the partner they had since day 1. Just my opinion.
Thanks to all of you that keep this site going. I know it’s a lot of work, but it’s appreciated.
@Julia, Nyle is by far getting the most exposure on DWTS Facebook, which at this point makes sense since he’s so far ahead in the game, but it can also be said that Wanya is getting hardly any so how can people comment when the show is all but ignoring him?
I don’t think the Sabrina comment was coincidental and off the cuff. Someone scripted that line. Maybe it was Maks himself since he considers Jodie and Candace friends, or maybe it was the producers.
Yes and No, Kat. You can’t just say “we don’t know so we have to base it off scores” – there have been MANY times when the low person didn’t go home in the history of the show. In fact, there have been many occasions when someone not even close to the bottom went home. If the low person always went home there would be no point in discussing it. Fact is, judges scores and viewer votes each count 50% – that means you can’t always predict who it will be.
Facebook used to be a good indication of who was *leaving* but it’s never been a good indication of who is doing well. People can like a dancer…but not vote for her because they like someone else better.
Meggie, I wavered back and forth between Jodie and Doug so many times you wouldn’t believe it. For some reason, Kim leaving didn’t enter my mind…gut feeling? I have no idea. I could be wrong. We’ll see!
@Rose1 Yes, Nyle is without a doubt getting the most love on Facebook, and pretty much everywhere! I think Jodie is getting the second most on there and Ginger third, but maybe Heidi is right and praise on Facebook doesn’t necessarily equal more votes. I just thought it was interesting and sort of strange that Paige and Wanya aren’t getting more than they are. Not sure what you’re saying about Wanya though.
@Heidi If Facebook might be an indicator of who is leaving I guess it could be Doug? A lot of people on there seem to want him gone, but viewers can’t directly vote AGAINST someone so not sure.
I do think tptb are using FB and now IG to highlight the person that is doing well though. They are looking for hits and Nyle is getting them plenty. I’m actually surprised they are giving Jodie that much exposure given the way they’ve treated her on the show. That one’s a head scratcher IMO.
Just wanted to add that Nyle did say he can feel vibrations of loud music. He didn’t mention whether that’s how he trains though.
I say Doug goes home He just has too much to overcome Although I am afraid for Jodie just because she’s paired with Keo She would be so much better if paired with Mark or Val we saw that last week. It may not matter if she’s too hurt to continue hopefully she can stay in the competition
Part of me thinks that Doug is going home – that everyone likes him, but they’ve also seen enough of his dancing to say “it’s been a pleasure, but we don’t want to see more of this” so they didn’t vote for him. The other part thinks that because he’s got such a heartfelt story, is a legend, and has been calling the Patriots fans to arms (are they listening? He invoked BOTH Brady and Belichek!) that those are not insurmountable numbers. We can use the Kurt Warner example again – but he was also a better dancer and had the conservative vote as well. But Doug doesn’t need nearly the rallying cry that Kurt did.
Then when we get to Jodie – I think she’s getting SOME support, but not as much as the producers expected – and I do think they want her and Keo to stick around – thus the warning shots of the jeopardy and the producer-fed comment about Sabrina. This brings to mind the Rumer jeopardy appearances, the “make sure you are dialing carefully” etc. Not-so-subtle manipulation, but I don’t think it necessarily means she’s in imminent danger – ESPECIALLY because she had such a strong dance last week and the producers have everyone on high-alert for her. So if she doesn’t withdraw, I’m calling her likely safe with these margins. For subsequent weeks – might be a different story if voters again become complacent about her.
Then we get to Kim – who had a rough week – despite a beautiful dance, the scores were pretty harsh and it became all about Keo and not her. She’s again in that danger zone of being high enough that it doesn’t seem like she’s in trouble, so complacency can loom. I think in her benefit is her amazing partnership with Sasha and her personality shines through. But again those margins aren’t big enough for me to feel any semblance of safety for her. Could be my own paranoia because I like her so much, but if she goes home I will not be surprised at all, just disappointed.
My pick though for the surprise elimination based on these numbers is Antonio. Again not low enough to seem in danger, plus he had an unflattering package, and a fanbase that seems to subsist ONLY of diehard Steelers fans that haven’t given up on him and Sharna’s devoted brood. Could it be enough for another week? Maybe – but if something drastic doesn’t change soon, I smell trouble.
So I’ll say Doug is the likely elimination, but then Antonio, then Kim, then Jodie. I HOPE it’s any of those three except Kim, but I would be fine with Jodie over the other two if she’s healthy enough to dance. I do love me some Karina though, so on the chance that Doug overcomes the deficit I’ll enjoy her for another week.
Oh, yes, they use FB, IG and twitter as tools of manipulation, but FB has a poor track record of predicting placement at the end of a season, so I tend to discount those numbers. Youtube is the same way. People may watch dances, but it doesn’t always translate to votes.
Julia, it was an indication based on the number of likes on their photo – but that hasn’t really been true for a couple seasons. First, people figured out it was a “thing” and once they figure it out, the “thing” is over because people change their behavior. Then DWTS started seriously staggering when photos/videos were posted, sometimes they got pulled down…the list goes on. I think it was Bindi that got a very quick million or two views on a video on DWTS facebook and they deleted it and reposted it again later. When hey know people are watching, they will start tinkering.
I would never trust the comments alone. You know what they say about squeaky wheels. FB is full of those.
Great work, PH! I can see why you rewrote the last paragraph several times. I’ve been waffling all damn week.
I think it’s Doug’s *time* to go. He’s had a good run & like Susan2, it makes me sick to see a decent human being treated like dirt by those who aren’t fit to clean his boots. However, he could be raking in the votes.
If Doug stays, I’d kind of like Jodie to be the one who goes. She’s a sweetheart, but I see her ankle becoming a liability & Keo isn’t good enough to work around it.
I have every finger & toe crossed that it’s NOT Kim, but I’m worried. I knew things could be dicey because of The Stooges’ antics so I did some numbers crunching of my own right after the show before I voted. I was so appalled by the numbers, that Kim got my votes. I hope it was enough!
Whether it be this week or next (due to Jodie’s injury/possible withdrawal), I don’t see how, much as I like the guy, it’s not Doug on par for elimination. This week’s elim is based, in part, on his botched (albeit fun) Disney dance while next’s would roll the Bollywood attempt (which I can’t see him exceling in). If Doug somehow escapes the next round, it would likely be in lieu of Kim. I’d say Antonio and possibly even Von might be longshots.
I hope Jodie is OK but the clip on GMA this morning was hard to watch -she looked like she was in so much pain. I wouldn’t be surprised if she has to withdraw.
Personally, I hope Doug stays – I would much rather see Antonio go – he’s just so full of himself. I didn’t know any of the football players coming into this season but I was really touched by Doug’s story and I like Von too.
I have several accounts so most of my votes are going to Wanya, Paige and Nyle followed by Doug and Kim.
I really didn’t enjoy last Monday’s show at all because of the Black Hole Asshattery Judging and I’m hoping that’s the last time we see the ballroom expert Maks at the judging table.
Since DWTS is essentially a popularity contest, here’s a decending order breakdown of Twitter followers:
Celebs
A Brown 546k
J Sweetin 260k
G Zee 184k
V Miller 173k
P Vanzandt 150k
N DiMarco 138k
K Fields 84.2k
D Flutie 44.6k
W Morris 18k
Pros
Val C 483k
Mark B 416k
Karina S 331k
Peta M 199k
Whitney C 142k
Sharna B 102k
Lindsay A 66.9k
Sasha F 50.8
Keo M 19.1
I wait every week to devour this post! I think after quite a bit of study, I understand how you come up with the raw numbers, PH. But it’s that combined with years of watching the show and instinct that makes this post a favorite of mine! Always plenty of food for thought here.
Let’s say that I HOPE it is Doug that will be eliminated if Jodie doesn’t have to withdraw. Not because I don’t like him, Doug Flutie seems to be a stellar man. And easy on the eyes! I enjoy Karina too. But Doug clearly isn’t enjoying this much, he isn’t improving and others in the danger zone are. Particularly Kim and Sasha. I’m very worried for them. Like Figmentation, I don’t think Jodie was in true danger. I think it’s more that she’s not as expendable to TPTB as others, like Marla and Kim so they were trying to ensure that KEO stay in the competition longer this round.
I agree with comments about exposure. Nyle has the most exposure on FB, IG, and Twitter follow by Ginger. I went on FB couple times and hardly any post on Wanya. It’s hard to comment about him without posting it on another celebs. Don’t get me wrong, Nyle is good but I prefer Wanya over him even over Paige. These 3 are the ones I watch on YouTube and there’s just something about Wanya the other 2 doesn’t have. But I won’t be mad if Nyle win. Maybe Lindsay should play the “I have never won” card (_8^(1)
Adam Twitter followers mean absolutely nothing in terms of votes just ask Cody Simpson or Hayes Grier. Facebook isn’t a great indicator either in terms of eliminations. I remember the DWTS Facebook in S17 and S19 when basically every post was people whining about Bill Engvall and Tommy Chong not getting eliminated. The same applied for Tamar last season and Chris Soules before that.
Agreed M8! While there’s certainly an element of “popularity contest” in DWTS, a celeb’s Twitter followers aren’t an indication of DWTS popularity or voting power, and a pro’s Twitter followers alone aren’t enough to win a couple the MBT.
Thanks Colleen – and everyone else who’s read and either enjoyed or worried over this one. 🙂
I think it will be Doug going home but I’m not completely sure.
I’ll be upset if it’s Kim and Sasha but I think it’s a possibility.
As for Jodie, I think she’s on her way out. I think it’s too late to turn this into a winning situation. Maks has gone out of his way to give Keo a hard time to the point that I think many people are on Keo’s side but I don’t think it matters.
And if I never see Maks on DWTS again it would be too soon. Every time I think about him on the show my blood boils.
I am interested in how they portray Antonio and Sharna on Monday.
Adam, besides the fact that twitter doesn’t transfer into votes, you inflated Vals number by 200000 followers.
What I find interesting – and probably NOT what Maks intended – is that he took a bunch of people (many represented here on this website, including me) who were actually *missing* him and really not minding the idea of him coming back to judge on occasion and completely turned most, if not all, of them against him once again. It’s fascinating how he and his brother continually take positive situations where they could capitalize and get ahead and gain something and completely shit on them! That is a special kind of talent right there. Squandering your future. And let’s face it, if he gets a permanent job out of that performance, this show ain’t long for the world because even I might have to turn the channel. I don’t need that kind of negativity and nastiness in my life on a weekly basis.
If twitter/instagram were that significant in how the show was going to turn out every season, Derek would win even more, as none of the other pros come close. Also, Zendaya would have won. So would Nick have Nick over Bindi. Jennifer Grey shouldn’t have won her season…the list goes on.
I think that another reason FB/IG/YouTube aren’t a good indication is because they can all be viewed worldwide, but the show itself isn’t, so people will often watch the videos but not vote/can’t vote. So some of those views/likes potentially come from people outside of America who don’t vote.
I’m from Australia, and for example with Bindi, plenty of people here watched the videos but didn’t vote.
I also found the dwts website bans me from voting because I’m outside the US.
Pretty sure that international voters can still vote on facebook -but that’s the only way they can vote. I know lots of Australians were voting for Bindi.
Great post! I concur with mostly everyone else that, and after deep thought, I’m still flip flopping back and forth betw/ the aforementioned folks.
Personally, I think Kim and Sasha are leaving Monday night. Even though I’d prefer Doug to leave. If Doug does leave, I HOPE we’ll see Karina durnig trio week with a couple. I think Jodie will survive next week because of her dance with Val. If the scores were lower, then I think she’d leave first.
Also, I too once thought FB/IG/TW views would correspond to eliminations, but I remember reading this debacle on the site here and thus have stopped doing so.
However, has anyone noticed how Nyle and Sharna got 3 MILLION views on FB. That’s amazing! Reminds me of Bindi’s millions of views. Also, Antonio deleted his Instagram?? I mean its still there…just with no pictures or followers except 19 followers. Was his instagram HACKED?
Is anybody knows this Monday double or single elimination?
My guess is single. They usually announce double elimination well in advance.
I recant my statement. He changed his name to ab instead of antoniobrown84. A todos, Lo siento!
@Kitti: Yea I don’t think its a double. TPTB would prob. advertise that its a double like crazy for possible viewership.
I think it’ll be either Kim or Doug. Either way I think Kim going first tonight means she’ll be going home next week if she survives this week, especially with Antonio going last.
I think it will be Doug. I wouldn’t mind it being Antonio after that, then Ginger.
I still feel the next two to go will be Doug and Kim in some order, unless Jodie’s ankle forces her out.
Wishful thinking but…could Antonio please go instead?!
I wouldn’t cry a bit if Antonio went home in a “shocking” elimination this week.
But even if Doug pulls it off this week this dance won’t help him. I just can’t see him being able to make his Bollywood routine look good. In fact, with the precise movements I can see him getting very frustrated, I’m almost expecting to see a bad rehearsal package. It infuriates me that Doug is busting is rear to do a good job while Antonio is coasting along making a half-assed effort at best.
I think you forget, M8, that going first is not BAD. It’s only bad because it tends to be slightly underscored. Unfortunately, I don’t feel like Kim and Sasha are making a big impact, so going first is probably a lucky get.